Hi all, was just browsing through some of the Live boards and saw that the clerics had a proposed list of spells they would like to see on the new expansion. Although, most likely, Dev's already made what they think will be useful i wouldn't mind posting a reasonable list for BL as well. Please list suggestions so i might /modify, along with a creative name =). I do know as i am creating this list it will get long, however from the long list we,.. together can determine what is more useful.
76 A) (suggestion for group 50% haste)
B) (suggestion for a single self + pet buff, only 55-60% haste + combat effects)
C) (New Focus hopefully + added stats)
D) ( New Heal larger heal)
77 A) (Poison Based Nuke)
B) (De-buff of some kind of attack/stats upgrade to Incapacitate)
C) (Spiritual Vim upgrade +Overcap Combat effects)
78 A) (New Pet haste)
B) Tome of some sort...... (defensive or offensive)
C) (Cold Based Nuke)
79 A) (probably another Warder Model)
B) (Growl upgrade or at least a non mandatory pet link)
C) (Upgrade to SE)
80 A) (As Usual probably some Warder proc)
B) (new slow - 45 Magic Resist)
C) (A Cure spell ... or Shared Heal with pet, with cure effects please please please do not mandatory link with pet)
D) (Summon pet i.e. Bestial empathy upgrade)
Posted 6/15/2007 eqforums
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Explanations
76 A) We are long overdue for a group haste, hopefully minimum 30+ minutes. Accuracy/CE/Attack on this would be a bad idea for the mere fact of stacking issues with other buffs it might block........ i.e. champ, better shammy haste, ranger predator, our own Vim.
B) To enhance soloing efforts, a self buff of a higher haste with increased Combat effects can help both the soloists and some..... group beast. Tag on an illusion to this and it will be fun! (not needed though).
C) Mini wunshi of overcap stats would be nice, however if not, at least a focus upgrade of HPs+ stats
D) With increased HP's pools of the game a suggestion of a 3k + minimum heal ( why 3k min? Math: 3k heal + 60% focus item (<-- not easy to get ) + crit = potential 9.6k heal if all moons are aligned right with most likely a raid quality heal focus.) Same cast time as all the others.
77 A) As with most classes, they specialize in 2 elements beasts roar for Cold and Poison to be it!! Thanks to the last TBS spell most beasts have even gotten poison focus items for that One spell. Lets add another.
B) We are overdue for a weaken type spell to incapacitate......... if u want to add uniqueness/raid utility....... make it a minus attack debuff similar to Gelid Claw.
C) It is time for BL to have a unique buff ability, Combat Effects would be a nice addition to a Vim upgrade.
78) A) Cookie cutter beast spell
B) Open for suggestions
C) Cookie cutter beast spell
79 A) Cookie cutter beast spell
B) Would be nice to offer an upgrade to the Growl series....... or at least break the mandatory link to pet.
C) Cookie cutter beast spell
80 A) Cookie cutter beast spell
B) This spell would be mainly Contingent on upgrade to fellow slowing classes.
C) Beasts have no means to cure themselves of any detrimental curses and when they do get it they are punished 2x. Either have a minimum of a single target cure spell ........... or a suggestion for a Cure+ heal spell for Self and Pet combined in 1. This will enhance the ability to solo as well as not take away any utility to other classes in raids.
D) Beastlords love this spell.....any improvement on it will be a bonus.........instead of the spam pets though could a single larger size pet be summoned with increased dps... or a different color model be used......... so not to punish BL for the immense pet push
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Topics under discussion
1) 5% over slow, non stacking with BL slows? Is this enough utility for raids/groups. Is this Game breaking? Do beastlords deserve this spell compared to fellow slowers
2) Suggestions for Aggro Reducing spells? Needed? or not Needed?
3) Pet invulnerabilities spells: How often do you use them? Do we need more? or enough is enough on them!!
This list has changed many times, and many thanks fellow beasts who helped me with this =). Its nice to see that BL's are not a dead class!!
Thanks to : Tigrah, Horkarz, Hakaaba, Karena, Jitathab, Sikkem, Jili, Greystoke, Bham, Pakratz, Grbage, Maykuab, Pindol
don't forget the halfhearted dots, and yet another mostly worthless fero.
I'd like to see the swarm pet continued personally :D
I'm anticipating yet another kitty crack also... surprise surprise.
I would really like to see more spells which enhance both the warder and bst at once.
If you're serious about creating a list, I'd leave out the cheap shots.
another poison or even diseased based nuke along with cold nuke.
limit it to 1 haste
We don't need another slow, we already do the same % slow as chanters with a higher resist mod
another poison nuke in lieu of dots would be good
more cold nukes were going to get obviously
SE upgrade, obviously
growl upgrade would be nice
I would think a group haste instead of a single target haste would be more beneficial.
We might be able to get a group haste but a better % haste is probably out. Dev on a thread about potions just got word from Prat that they are going to leave haste and clarity pots at X and go no higher.
I would like to see our next set of stat buffs break the cap finally.
Just because they are leaving potions at current level does not mean Beastlords cannot get upgrades. Why should we only be as good as some stuff in a bottle? Why should the stuff in a bottle be as good as we are? Why should the buffs in a bottle last longer, for that matter? We NEED to demand better stuff. We NEED to NOT settle for status quo.
id like to see a haste thats group 50% haste that lasts any period longer than 30 minutes with a token mod to make it nominally better than potion haste.
Ferocious Celerity: group base duration 29 minutes (scr makes this > 30)
mana cost: ~1500
+50% haste
+100 attack
This could even serve to be our fero upgrade, since we know were not getting anything useful anyway. 100 attack is probably 8-10 dps per melee in the group so its definatly better than bottle haste while not being super-powerful such that they wouldn't give it to us.
<gets out dead horse> I'd really like to see utility spells, give us some value on a raid. Here are some ideas (ok a few dps ones thrown in too)...
1. Eye of the beast. Allows you to bind sight with and control your warder (like stalking probe). Would allow scouting, pretargeting, or even aggroing something deep in a zone (imagine the trains!).
2. Guard Dog. Would allow warder to "guard" a target PC by taking aggro from him and then become invulnerable for 2 ticks. Would be great for keeping clerics alive and possibly as a ghetto weaponshield in a tight spot.
3. Obedience. Makes /pet hold the default state after mob dies. No need to hit your hot key after every kill. Imagine the peace of mind for both you and your raid leader.
4. Teeth Bare. Warder bares his teeth, convincing mob that he's more of a threat than you are. Essentially transfers your hate to your warder, giving us a legitimate way of dropping aggro.
5. Bear Hide. Single target immunity to stun (short duration). Imagine raid leader calling for BLs to Bear Hide all the tanks!
6. Panther Leap. Allows BL to jump 3x as high/far. How cool would that be!
7. Bestial Tracking. Would bring up one of those funky yellow lines leading to a PC or mob that is currently on target. Would not overlap much with ranger track (not target based). Be good for finding group members.
8. Bestow MGB. Not really a BL-type thing, but wth. Allows a BL to transfer his available MGB to another PC, thus refreshing their MGB. Would allow a cleric to cast 2 MGB heals in a row for example or allow that 1 enchanter on raid to MGB both haste and c7. Good for Auspice too.
9. Cure curse (or corruption). Similar to current Ranger spell.
10. Group Ferocity. AE or group spell that adds dps to group (CE or overcap Accuracy or anything but useless Attack boost).
11. Warder Meld. BL & warder meld into 1, warder dies and BL takes on warder illusion. BL dps goes up by 50% of dps that warder would do. Permanent while in zone. Would be great for those myriad of no-pet events.
12. Warder Sacrifice. Warder dies, transfering 50% of his HP to you. Desparation heal.
13. Maul. Warder gets a 100% boost to dps, but loses 25% of his HP each tick for 6 ticks. He will die unless healed. That delayed heal would rock with this.
Growl update would be cool too, it's about time for one of these.
I like a lot of Pak's ideas, don't know how keen SoE would be to implement them. As for haste group version with a secondary stat would be good, we don't need a haste % increase because most people are at or damn near the cap, arguing for a non needed increase could mean we miss out on getting a useful upgrade.
Would like a similar heal to rangers with a cure component.
Poison nukes, but maybe a lower dmg / mana nuke so that we're not adding to any agro problems.
Cold nuke, faster refresh than the current 30seconds but also with a deagro component.
Mini Wunshi with over stat buffs.
Spiritual Vim but with a mod2 component as well, not as good as rangers since they have 0 hp's but make it a valid alternative since I am never asked for this buff outside of groups.
An aura of some kind - maybe this could be a defensive / deagro aura so that we might get put into DPS groups (personal bugbear with my guild atm :-P)
ah yes, there is a spell you are forgetting, or is that just covered in heal/cure.
Pet heal (ubber)
Target heal (suxor)
Give me a new Slow you Hosers! One that doesn't get resisted!
BST aura that does group haste at 50% would be preferable to a spell. Either wasy group 50%, duration greater than 30.
This is what i expect to see
New single warder, new warder proc, new warder haste
New poison nuke, new ice nuke
New spell no bst ever asked for that fundementaly doesnt work, and is broken but seemed like a good idea.
Growl 2
SV/ SE "upgrades"
combined Spell and mellee blocker pet spell
BE 3
Some crappy dot
single target heal
some sort of pet heal
Quote from: Greystoke on June 06, 2007, 09:19:05 PM
Just because they are leaving potions at current level does not mean Beastlords cannot get upgrades. Why should we only be as good as some stuff in a bottle? Why should the stuff in a bottle be as good as we are? Why should the buffs in a bottle last longer, for that matter? We NEED to demand better stuff. We NEED to NOT settle for status quo.
My fault for not explaining. In the thread about potions it was stated that they could not see a reason for coming out with better then a 50% haste pot because most people are near to hitting the 100% haste cap with just a 50% haste tossed in. I have a problem with that statement in that most people I know have between 30-40% haste item. That gives us some wiggle room before hitting the stat cap.
Anyway the statemt left a sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach for us getting an upgrade in haste %.
3. Obedience. Makes /pet hold the default state after mob dies. No need to hit your hot key after every kill. Imagine the peace of mind for both you and your raid leader.
The devs have explicitly said they want pets to require attention and won't do this.
6. Panther Leap. Allows BL to jump 3x as high/far. How cool would that be!
Completely useless
What about some sort of upgrade to Incapacitate that also included and Attack debuff?
If the debuff stacked with the shaman and druid lines it would gives us a job on raids also... :roll:
In reality though I expect same ol same ol and especially a new fero even though they have stated it doesnt really do anything.
Pakratz,
Thank you for the time of creating that list, however looking through it,... it seems most those abilities belong in the Tome/ AA section of Beastlords.
Looks like you line item number 9 and 10, agree's with the list above =)
The one thing though, that i would watch on your list is the following.
2. Guard Dog. Would allow warder to "guard" a target PC by taking aggro from him and then become invulnerable for 2 ticks. Would be great for keeping clerics alive and possibly as a ghetto weaponshield in a tight spot.
This may seem a bit overpowering in the raid aspect. Twelve seconds invulnerability teamed up with ultimate aggro can be sooooo exploited by an army of Beastlords.
=)
Quote from: Tomorrow on June 08, 2007, 12:13:03 PM
2. Guard Dog. Would allow warder to "guard" a target PC by taking aggro from him and then become invulnerable for 2 ticks. Would be great for keeping clerics alive and possibly as a ghetto weaponshield in a tight spot.
This may seem a bit overpowering in the raid aspect. Twelve seconds invulnerability teamed up with ultimate aggro can be sooooo exploited by an army of Beastlords.
=)
then make it like manablaze, where only one can be used at a time and then there is a cool down timer.
I would drop the disease nuke, I have enough foci to try to get hold of anyway. Didn't even get me a nice poison one yet :|
Most Hybrids get 2 resists to cast nukes from. Rangers get fire and ice, SKs get disease and magic (if u count lifetaps) and we only had ice. WE now have ice and poison. I think we should stick ot ice and poison, and not try to add a 3rd.
Very true Jili and Greystoke =). I can see how itemization for disease now can become quite a juggle. Not to mention we need to be careful on what we ask for. Sometimes asking for too many new things will hurt more than help.
What I would like to see
New warder/s, new warder haste and new warder proc
New ice and poison nuke's
New targettable heal, new warder delayed heal.
New growl of the panther type spell.
New Bark at the moon spell (however it has a chance to proc 1 pet that is 4 times more powerful, rather than proccing 4 standard pets)
New version of SE, SV and focus (breaks stat cap, useful only when no shaman around)
Group haste 50%, plus a mod (I would like to see accuracy or CE, that stacks with gear), minimum base duartion 36 min.
New 65% slow, with a -45 resist, same timer and duration as the level 70 slow.
Most importantly I want a new spell or AA, that gives beastlords, and beastlords only, a useful and unique ability that is required or extremely useful to have on a raid, and that requires some level of skill on behalf of the player of the beastlord to implement, so that the ideal raid-force has approximately 3 main beastlords
Ideally it should be a debuff that has a duration 1/3 of its recast, so that 3 beastlords will be required to keep it up continuosly, or a buff that has its duation/ recast set up in such a way that multiple beastlords are required to keep it up on everyone who would need it. Personally I would prefer the debuff.
"Most importantly I want a new spell or AA, that gives beastlords, and beastlords only, a useful and unique ability that is required or extremely useful to have on a raid, and that requires some level of skill on behalf of the player of the beastlord to implement, so that the ideal raid-force has approximately 3 main beastlords"
Exactly! Bham hits it right on the head imo. My list of ideas off the top of my head was to get the discussion going in this direction.
well.....what we need is an unique, beastlord only spell and I would like to see Over-slow spell which stacks with shaman and chanter slows, but not our own to eliminate overpowering talks. With so many mobs taking only partial slow, this would make beastlords a must have on raids. What percentage and other details would need to be decided after some testing, but the idea should make all beastlords happy, IMO.
Quote from: Pindol on June 10, 2007, 07:07:44 PM
well.....what we need is an unique, beastlord only spell and I would like to see Over-slow spell which stacks with shaman and chanter slows, but not our own to eliminate overpowering talks. With so many mobs taking only partial slow, this would make beastlords a must have on raids. What percentage and other details would need to be decided after some testing, but the idea should make all beastlords happy, IMO.
might even make the skeptics, who don't like us having anything good happy.
Bham
The only 3 on you list that have not been suggested are the following,
1) New version of SV and focus (breaks stat cap, useful only when no shaman around)
---SV will be determined by Rangers + Paladins getting a boost in their existing Categories
---Overcap focus will be borderlining stepping on Shaman's Territory however as it sits now in order for us to have Shaman's Focus its a 2 part spell ( Focus + Infusion ), if anything they might combine the 2 together to give us a new Focus spell + stats we can only pray for Wunshi but by that time our natural stats due to the level gains will be similar to what wunshi can offer.
2) Group haste 50%, plus a mod (I would like to see accuracy or CE, that stacks with gear), minimum base duartion 36 min.
--This here is an interesting one, i can see potential stacking issues with accuracy and the ranger Predator series, or even the Better haste from an Enchanter. I would have to see a better description of this before i suggest.
3) New 65% slow, with a -45 resist, same timer and duration as the level 70 slow.
--Currently our level 70 slow is at the level as the Shamans + Enchanters at -24 disease. We would probably will get a new slow if and only if Shamans+ Enchanters get a bump. It might get resisted less however the mitigation will be the exact same.
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Pakratz +Pindol+ Tigrah
Currently there are 4 slowing classes Shamans 75%>Enchanters 70% >Beastlords 65%>Bards 48%. At first looking at the overslow idea, i was at awe and thought OMG great idea !!! After thinking it through a bit, mainly on the how? side....... If we were to get lets say a 5% overslow, Enchanters (imo who is also a dying breed =( )would be screaming bloody murder because we would be stepping on thier toes. We are not the best slowers, and we are not the worst. Another thing to also look at is stacking. Currently, we are at 65% unmitigated, if this stacks with our own slows, this would be boarderlining class imbalancing (i.e. 65% +5% = poor chanties) . The main reason i use 5% as a number too is because the fact it is easier to incrementallly step it down per mitigation level i.e. Slighly overslowed = .20 x 5 = 1% so we do not have to deal with rounding error problems. Again i would have to see a more description to suggest =)
One small note: heheh please refrain from the AA's selection part on this thread so we do not astray too much off topic =)
The way to not step on chanter's toes is to make it a separate slow spell that just doesnt stack with our slow line but will stack with chanter/shammy spell lines. It would make it useful to stack us with another slower in the group.
I like the idea but see two drawbacks to it. First is it takes a slowers off the lfg table (great for us bad for groups needing a slower). Second, SOE would just beef up the mobs more then they are now making life even harder for the melee soloers, undergeared tanks and those wearing silk. Over the last two expansions things have got rough enough for these groups.
our slows are magic based that adds disease counters. I believe our 70 slow is -30 to magic.
I checked and it is -30 to magic.
You can scrap the disease based nuke. It was a thought, but others have noted valid reasons not to have another elemental based nuke. I like the over-slow idea. I wonder if it could be added and work on existing mobs?
The best enchanter slow I could find was dreary deeds, a 70% slow with a -10 magic adjust and shaman have 75% with a -40 magic adjust.
http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spell.html?id=6826&source=Live That is chanters best slow, 70% -30 magic resist.
We will never get a new slow without at least shamans getting a better new slow. More dps upgrades might even become detrimental as we already have agro issues with what we have. Besides giving us a role in raid situations or an upgrade to paragon that actually help (which will never happen), the best thing we can really hope for is a way to drop hate, or at least survive when we get it. Some form of agro loss would benefit us greatly. A dodge/block/riposte disc, FD to some degree, lowering roar of thunder recast substantialy (I would like to see it at 30-45 seconds) or an upgrade to rake that's hate lowering instead of increasing. Having something along these lines would increase our dps simply by allowing us to go all out without having to hold back for fear of getting hate.
What I expect to see is minor upgrades to crap we already have and maybe 2 random new spells that no one wants and dont help in any way. Maybe if we're lucky they'll give us another 25 points of double attack =/
A beastlord version of Jolting Kicks would be good. Makes very little sense that a monk variant has absolutely no agro reduction, I don't see that Sony would reduce the recast on Roar by much since it is also a low resist DD. I would like a disc - maybe called blinding strike = medium amount of damage but allows you to avoid mobs attention.
So maybe recast on roar of 1min 30 and an additional agro reduction tool. I'm less nervous about Sony for the next expansion since they've done a good job with us on recent expansions, interesting spells with good DPS increase, I'm giving them a chance this time.
I dont think agro is that big a deal, bite is only a problem if you lead nuke with it and are using slow. If BST's die early on raids, it is after the zerks, monks and rogues because we dual wield low ratio weapons when you use roar.
http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spell.html?id=10361&source=Live
our best slow is 70% with a neg mod of 60 magic tiny bit better then a chanters best slow sept for the innate problems with using this slow for those that use steeltrap casted by us 65% aye but st is 70% just wanted to point that out = )
Quote from: jitathab on June 13, 2007, 12:21:04 PM
I dont think agro is that big a deal, bite is only a problem if you lead nuke with it and are using slow. If BST's die early on raids, it is after the zerks, monks and rogues because we dual wield low ratio weapons when you use roar.
I've managed to yank agro many times using bite in groups where I was not slowing. Heck, I've even got it when waiting quite a while prior to nuking. The tanks I was with were quite capable of keeping agro so they were probably just slacking and I took them by suprise but still, that takes a bit of agro to do.
Beast aggro can be a bear at times, hehe no pun intended, however for myself its tough for me to determine whether its because our class has too much aggro? , my aggressive gameplay of slow+nuke+ rake+kick is not timed correctly? , or the main tank is just not maintaining enough hate?
When the I get aggro, i do believe its really a combination of all 3 to some extent. Aggro management for every class is key.
Now, as for the Aggro reduction. I really do think we really need to separate damage and aggro reducing. Take for instance the Beast Roar, the main key element in that, in which i believe that makes it a 10 min timer if the fact that it Does dmg. It might be a bit too much to ask for dmg reduce + extra dps ..... on a short timer. We are due for a tome of some sort, but if it is an aggro reducer it will be like Zero Damage and block out Rake. Just a thought. =)
I do agree an agro reducing disc should be no damage but...why should it grey out rake? Havent asked a ranger if jolting kick locks out any other ability but FD sure as heck doesnt grey anything else out. None of the other agro reducing abilities I can think of block any other ability as far as I know.
zerker jolt blocks out volly.
I dont like it but it make's sense at least for a zerker point of view they push them selves to the berserking point but if you push to far your gonna grab agro and die lol. As for us a deagro jolt it is something that would be used in a ''oh shit'' moment like one to many coggy procs along with a slow resist and bite crit and bam you have agro hit a jolt and pop back off the radar we have that all ready in the form of the raor of thunder line but even with the reuse timer aa's 7 min is just to long.
I guess the question i should first be asking........ before assuming, lol (u know what happens then). At what refresh rate of the tome abilitiy would you be usable. If the answer is 30 seconds.......... it will block out rake. Increasing it to more than that might only give u a 1 maybe 2 chances of using that ability during any raid burns would that be enough? For most classes, ive noticed playing my warrior alt, every new tome comes with a price. =(
On the other hand......if someone were to make an AA suggestive list........(btw offtopic and not this thread lol). Perhaps one might suggest 5 levels of AA's to reduce Roar 1 minute per level maintaining the same dmg. If that were to happen then we can just suggest either an offensive or defensive tome. =)
*rolls up sleeves*
here goes,
- Id like to see us get a targetable HoT spell, as a shammy type were due one, were losing the utility that we once had and lucky for us most classes have yet to realise,
- our heals are slow and small, are pet heals are big but so slow in casting that unless you pet is on hold chances are itll be dead before the heal lands,
- mana after death - on druzzil were experiancing a lack of shamans, meaning bsts take this role, are mana regen is small, after a death & when you need to buff a grp its painful to sit around for ooc regen to kick in, wait for full mana, buff a grp or 2 then rinse and repeate until the raid is buffed.
- SE rk2 im happy with, pointless upgrading it as with aos (paragon) the out of combat regen makes these far less usful then they were.
- you have become better at double attack (25) yay... umm, wouldnt mind seeing that improve.
- we should gain a powerful skill that can be used if we dont have a pet up to make us usful on raids, a surge of power if you like to make up for our lack of pets on 90pct of raid targets, i struggle to beat the lowest dps classes with my 2.0 and a 31/19 tonfa offer little else if our shammys arnt ninja /afking or anouther bst turns up.
- Enough said about haste , LOL....
as for other buffs, youll got great ideas and i cant wait to see what comes next,
- oh and remove are AC softcap, we cant take a hit for toffee :-D ( cant blame a cat for trying)
oh , RGC and Call ftw ) were a utility, give us skills
how about several (3-5) situational (meaning each has a different effect) MGBable spells or discs that could get either chained or stacked and would help raids.
some thoughts on a specifics
- make them only MGBable so they dont over power in grps?
- effects could be things like: endurance only regen (instant?)? large AC boost for raid? over damage or overstat (beyond shammy stuff)? super over haste?...new effects no one has yet.... (raid wide de aggro that adds hate to the target, meaning you focus raids hate into MT....or RT) etc.
Bottom line I was thinking of is would become the raid utility class much as we are a grp utility class by the raid leader being able to pick and choose what to chain or stack depending on the fight. I really think this could be a cool role and make us needed on raids.
flame/disregard/expand upon as you please. :)
Thanks,
Kope
Ubahcats, omg i would love to have an increased AC cap however following eqlive, even the devs had mentioned " we are exactly where they want us to be" =( For that reason, i am afraid that if i do mention it, it might cheapen the other requests/suggestions. RGC would be nice, i believe..... for now....... all we might be able to get away with is some sorta self cure. For we are pretty far away linked from the Cleric class, compared to the other RGC'ers.
Kobe, longer than we have been complaining about the fero issues, Warrs have been fighting for some sort of endurance regen buff from a class. Unfortunately, it seems the devs are keeping that exactly where it is. As for AC boost, i believe they have already given it to Warriors Aura on top of that most Raid tanks are dealing with overcap returns even on AC. I will though guarantee you......... If any class were to receive some sort of endurance regen MGB buff/aura/spell whether it be Beastlord/Enchanter (2 class in my book that needs help) they will be the most sought out after or b0tted =(. Again, unfortunately this request might fall along the lines of ..... beating a dead horse =( /em sighs sadly.
The main thing we need be careful on in requests is ......... how can we gain utility....... without stepping on other classes? Thats the trick. This is one of the main reasons why i suggest Combat Effects to Vim. It will make people think. Do i take pure heps w/ brells? Do i take more Accuracy with The ranger buff? or Do i take the mid road with CE? I do though still am open to suggestions, and it is quite nice to see responses from many different BL's =)
QuoteThe main thing we need be careful on in requests is ......... how can we gain utility....... without stepping on other classes? Thats the trick.
What my point above was - give us 3-5 MGBable raid oriented spells or discs that can be stacked or chained as needed. That is my proposed niche - The ability to MGB several different effects on raids.
The specific buffs were not really my point. As for endurance regen - I was thinking don't tie it to AoS, give us another buff that is endurance regen only.
Kope
Interesting thought Kobe, your idea of raid specific spells are not too far fetched. If i am reading this correct. Spells that could only be used in raids, and not groupable situations. I believe a topic similar has been brought up in eqlive boards, i just cant remember the link currently i might have to dig it up later =/.
I am sure raiders wouldnt mind having this, but as a casual group beast they might beg to differ. SoE though most likely will have to introduce 1-2 of these spells to every class, in order for this to happen........... and probably not to beasts only at first.
Quote from: Tomorrow on June 20, 2007, 07:05:09 PM
Interesting thought Kobe, your idea of raid specific spells are not too far fetched. If i am reading this correct. Spells that could only be used in raids, and not groupable situations.
Don't think he's saying that only beastlords in a raid could use this ability... he's saying that we have 1 - 3 unique abilities. For explanation sake.. we'll name them Kareem, Abdul, and Jabar.
The Dev's give us these 3 abilities. By themselves they are ok - But, when you MGB all 3 of them, (from 3 different beastlords) you get a mega mgb that does amazing things.
I hope that's what Kope was meaning.
Problem with that is managing Buff slots since they are in limited number or do you put them to the song window. Not tring to downgrade the idea I actually like it just that I dont see it ever happening honestly with out steping on another classes ability.
The idea of fero aura is still the best imho and maybe instead of the combat effects or accuracy with the introduction of the triple attack as a skill there could be a mod put on it there giving all within the groups aura having a tripple attack (btw im not takeing credit for that idea someone else mentioned it that I read) and it just really clicked as a usful ability and definitly would give us a utility in dps groups in a raid. If they (the devs) still refuse to do the aura maybe a buff kinda like champ but with said focus and similar fero combintion effects replacing the attack with the triple attack mod.
QuoteSoE though most likely will have to introduce 1-2 of these spells to every class, in order for this to happen........... and probably not to beasts only at first.
Why not BST only? when Luclin came out who else could cast a useful mid fight MGB (like Paragon)? I think I would get pissed if other classes got MGB spells that we better than AoS. This is something that has been BST only since we were introduced.
Yes put them in the song box I would say. if they are 40 ish seconds or less I dont think we are stepping on toes.
QuoteThe Dev's give us these 3 abilities. By themselves they are ok - But, when you MGB all 3 of them, (from 3 different beastlords) you get a mega mgb that does amazing things.
I was thinking about several (3-5) effects we could MGB. That , if we had 3 or 4 BSTs on a raid, could be chained (like AoS) or stacked (if one was AoS and one was endurance only). I am not suggesting what the spells be - just that our niche be raid mid fight MGBing.
I really like being DPS but I dont think that is ever going to be our niche; but if I could hit an MGB per fight that helped out which needed a strat to use right then get back to beating on a mob, I would like that. I really dont want to be a class that casts most of a fight.
Thanks
Kope (as in Copenhagen...the chewing tobacco not Kobe the fish) :-D
This is a copy of a post I made on a similar thread on the EQlive Beast forums.
This spell list is based off of a spreadsheet I created that lists all of our spells from PoP till now and broke down by spell lines and levels. For the major level increases during PoP, Omens, and TSS we received I think 22, 17, and 16 spells. There have been smaller expansions in between these that would add two or three spells. I am assuming that since EQ will only be going to one expansion a year we will also only be receiving spells once a year from now on. I have written a list similar in length to PoP that includes I think every spell line since PoP except cures, hp regen, acumen, and dispell. I also changed some of the spell levels to smooth out damage spells and utility and pet spells etc over the levels.
80
SoF Swarm Pet
SoF Ferocity
SoF Growl
SoF Slow
79
SoF Pet Proc
SoF Pet Rune
SoF Mana Regen
SoF Poisen DD
78
SoF Warder
SoF Pet Haste
SoF Rake
SoF Cold DD
77
SoF Heal
SoF Focus
SoF Disease Dot
SoF Beast Aura
76
SoF Pet Heal
SoF SV
SoF Poisen Dot
SoF Haste/Stats
80
a This pet needs to be given a higher level even if the base stats were kept the same as the TBS version to help it keep pace since levels mean so much in EQ.
b I would like to see a proc modifier added to this spell line similar to the Bard self song Jonthan's Mightful Caretaker to help make it more desireable and useful.
c I would like to see this spell brought up to 1750 or 2k hp, its HoT at 175 or 200 to match, and keep its 20 percent damage modifier.
d It would be useful to copy Sha's Legacy but increase the duration to 3.5 mins like our old slow spells for situations that we might want a longer lasting slow.
79
a This is a generic pet proc upgrade spell but I would like to see the prism skin effect upped a hit or maybe two.
b I personally would like to see our rune spells combined again. I have some doubt that they would be so instead I would to see some kind of rune a lot like Spellbreaker's Guard but in a melee form that would stack with its spell counterpart.
c This is generic mana regen upgrade but perhaps it could be 15 instead of 14. The older spell versions were always odd numbers and it would be nice to keep it this way.
d I would like this spell to keep its relative power of double the damage and mana to the cold nuke we will see in this expansion. In the spirit I see this spell line though I think it needs to share a timer with its TBS counterpart.
78
a This is a generic new warder.
b This is a generic new pet haste but I would like to see strength added back onto this like the Mage pet haste spells
c I believe this PoR disc could use a small boost. It parsed out to about 25 dps at the time and I would like to see that rise to maybe 35 dps or more.
d This is generic cold DD upgrade.
77
a This is generic spell heal spell. I would like to see hybrid heals looked at again in light of the quickly rising hp levels in the upper playerbase that comes from the top end TBS group armor and raid gear.
b This is focus upgrade.
c This is a generic disease dot upgrade.
d This is a new spell I would like considered. I was thinking of perhaps an aura that hits all pets and gives them similar effects as the Monk class aura. If auras on pets could be made to stack this could work well with the Mage class aura. I would like to see this aura also give pets higher avoidance and/or mitigation to enrage and wild rampage effects which are both very detrimental all pet classes in raids.
76
a This is a generic pet heal and cure upgrade.
b This is a generic SV upgrade.
c This is a generic poisen dot upgrade.
d This is another new spell I would like considered. Beastlords have long asked for a longer duration group haste spell. There has also been alto of talk about softcaping stats. I would like to see a 50 percent group haste spell that combines a group version of our Infusion of Spirit spell and has a 30 minute base duration.
What do you think ?
Kat
if only we had a CC to actually help push this forward
The best place for a direct answer on a short question is the HOC chat. If you get a question like " do you like fish" you will get an answer
I'm tired of the comments of having NO CC. What we need to do, have a select panel of beastlords WE decide to use, and spam the Developers on the boards and via emails so they can get a point that isn't coming clear to them. I for one will help in this. We just need to come to a consensus on what WE want. Then notify the people who will do the necessary acts, I figure if they aren't reading our forums/boards, we take the reading to them.
No one ever got anywhere in history by acting orderly, lets do something to get their attention instead of threats or complaining that may never get heard.
Sorry Kat I've been slacking a bit on your spell list, but better late response than never.
80
SoF Swarm Pet........agree mentioned above
SoF Ferocity wow attack + resist + Jonathan's i.e.
- Increase attack speed by 70%
- Increase all skill modifier by 6%
- Increase attack by 16
- Increase All Skills Minimum Damage by 204%
This imho is borderlining overpowering.....Imagine if this buff was casted on a Rogue?....For now I am going to have to disagree until i get more details...... Remember the reasons why Ferocity is broke is because Mobs have a set amount of AC....... Because of that when a specific amount of Attack is achieved......... you are at diminishing returns....... Unless SoE changes all the AC of every mob in their database to accommodate (alotta work). There will be forover this softcap. To be honest, why build on a broken line? BaTM has better burst dps at a less mana cost.
SoF Growl .......... agree mentioned above .... also added would like to break the link with the pet
SoF Slow ........... agree mentioned above
79
SoF Pet Proc ........agree mentioned above but not as detailed
SoF Pet Rune ........how powerful of a rune? Rampage + Enrage of a quad 4k hitter 1 round can be up to 16k. Would a 16k rune be overpowering would a 2k rune be enough?
SoF Mana Regen .... SE upgrade Mentioned above
SoF Poisen DD ....... Would like to break away from our DoTs agree totally......
78
SoF Warder ....... Agree mentioned above
SoF Pet Haste ....Agree did not mention above ......currently our Unparalleled Voracity is at 85% haste.... if the new haste was 95% (on a warder that does 200 dps at 85% current haste increased to 95% it is only a 10.81 dps upgrade ) Strength addition i hope will actually add more dps
SoF Rake ......Left that open for suggestions agree...... some posts suggest aggro drop tome, or even a Defensive
SoF Cold DD ......... Agree mentioned above
77
SoF Heal ...... Agree mentioned above but went in more detail perhaps an added cure effect
SoF Focus ...... Agree mentioned above however added stats
SoF Disease Dot .... Disagree
SoF Beast Aura .....Agree would be nice to help pet survivability
76
SoF Pet Heal ...../Sigh another wasted spell have to agree
SoF SV ..... Agree mentioned above hehe would like to add CE to this since attack has little benefit
SoF Poisen Dot ......... if we do have a DoT let it be poison /agree ....... most classes specializes in 2 elements let BL be Poison and Cold
SoF Haste/Stats ......... Needs be refined...... Stats may cause Stacking issues with Shammy buffs /disagree for now
Quote from: Tomorrow on July 12, 2007, 05:35:39 PM
80
SoF Swarm Pet........agree mentioned above
SoF Ferocity wow attack + resist + Jonathan's i.e.
- Increase attack speed by 70%
- Increase all skill modifier by 6%
- Increase attack by 16
- Increase All Skills Minimum Damage by 204%
This imho is borderlining overpowering.....Imagine if this buff was casted on a Rogue?....For now I am going to have to disagree until i get more details...... Remember the reasons why Ferocity is broke is because Mobs have a set amount of AC....... Because of that when a specific amount of Attack is achieved......... you are at diminishing returns....... Unless SoE changes all the AC of every mob in their database to accommodate (alotta work). There will be forover this softcap. To be honest, why build on a broken line? BaTM has better burst dps at a less mana cost.
One of the devs did mention they want to increase mob ac in the next expansion which would make fero useful again. But, knowing soe's history, fero would quickly stagnate again in expansions after that. That leaves me in the please get rid of fero category.
FYI:
Ferocity VII (worn):
Slot Description
1: Increase Double Attack by 18%
2: Increase All Skills Minimum Damage Modifier by 200%
So,
SoF Ferocity wow attack + resist + Jonathan's i.e.
- Increase attack speed by 70%
- Increase all skill modifier by 6%
- Increase attack by 16
- Increase All Skills Minimum Damage by 204%
This thought for a lvl80 Ferocity spell would be a worthlessly high mana cost/worthless ratio haste (unless you're adding an overhaste portion to it, which would be hard to make happen), and would add only 4% to minimum hit over high end geared melees (which will probably be eclipsed w/ Fero VIII). Leaving us w/ 6% to skills (no idea how much effect that would have, nfc whatsoever, but that would take a skill capped at 300 and make it only 318 - probably not much), and attack which is still dependent on mob AC.
One spell id like to see us get an upgrade of is our cripple line as we havent had an upgrade since lvl 56.
Diaron
Spells We should get..can figure out the levels later....dunno about you but I'd like some of the "good spells" a little early and in the middle...or at least one or two in each new spell level so that beastlords have something to enjoy and not get depressed about...
Ferocity Aura
Levitation
Talisman of the Tribunal
Spirit Viel - self only timed invis or AA insta cast (dreaming)
Group Stamina Buff that shammys currently have would be nice
New Nature's Wild Spirit - bst version of aggro reducing buff from rangers Nature's Viel
New Focus
New Vim
New Pet Haste
New Pet Summon
New Pet Proc
New SE
New Poison Nuke - a big must, that line owns..
New Single Target Heal that can cure poison/disease/curse/corruption
New Group Haste
New Single Target Haste
New Slow that WE CAST instead of the pet or trade off Steeltrap for this spell
New Frenzy of Spirit AA upgrade
New Rake discipline
New Protective Spirit disc
New Flying Kick skill
New Wurine Form AA like shammys would be bad ass, enhence melee dps output..or Perm illusion whatever your pet is...like rangers can turn to wolves ect...again enhances melee dps...movement speed ect..
Give us this for the years worth of expansion and I think we'd be happy campers..at least this is all I can think of and can put together from reading so many posts...