This makes absolutly no sense to me. Our warders are so integral to our class, it would be like a warriors armor poofing when he gets an invis.
At least fix it to where we can cast see invis on our warders. I know other pet classes hate this as well.
Probably not an issue since they changed pets to non aggro but invising to kill the pet used to be important when pets decided to go exploring on their own.
Quote from: MindletProbably not an issue since they changed pets to non aggro but invising to kill the pet used to be important when pets decided to go exploring on their own.
Agreed - was the same reason necro pets poofed with FD - but that was just reversed a few weeks ago, so invs with pets could/should be next.
There is currently a bug that will let you be invis with a pet, although it's completely pointless. (start casting pet, have someone invis you before you finish casting). I /bug'd it once, but apparently they didn't consider it important enough to fix.
While I don't mind having to suspend pet to invis, it really annoys me when a random druid casts group invis and there poof goes pet with all it's buffs, or when that bard who's playing song of travel runs up and kills pet. I don't really see any useful purpose to having invis kill pet nowadays.
From what I can imagine...
This will never go away.
Why? You are probably wondering.
Well, Beastlords are the only pet class that can not charm.
Enchanters = charm anything
Necromancers = charm undead
Magicians = charm summoned
others
Bard = anything level 57 and below
Druids = animals
Rangers = animals
Which is the main reason why invisibility is mainly used besides the obvious of hiding. Its the only way to break charm intendedly from the charmer.
Yeah, It sucks. My bard friend does it to me often, on accident.
Will they change it? Heck no, not for one class. Unless you would want to have an ICON back for your warder? Removing an extra buff slot.
It will never go away. Thats one of the issues with pets thats intented.
Suspend is the only workaround they will give.
iam pretty sure there will be a suspend minion 3 aa in oow... :wink:
Quotewas the same reason necro pets poofed with FD
The reason necro pets were changed to despawn after 2 minutes of the necro being FD was to prevent some risk free "exploits" that were going around the late classic/early kunark timeframe. Basically a necro would FD somewhere at a static spawn and would let the mobs agro on his pet. Once engaged, the necro would only get up to heal the pet or snare... if at all.
Just a FYI...
QuoteWell, Beastlords are the only pet class that can not charm.
Enchanters = charm anything
Necromancers = charm undead
Magicians = charm summoned
others
Bard = anything level 57 and below
Druids = animals
Rangers = animals
Rangers can't charm anything...but they can fear animals. Shaman have "Befriend Animal" at level 29 though.
I'm hoping for SM3...to allow a suspended pet to zone. But I won't hold my breath.
I can't see why we'd need an AA to make suspended pets zone if they're allowing unsuspended pets to zone. They just need to get enough feedback that it's wanted.
As for invis killing pets, I wish there was a "allow idiotic group members to invis me" toggle I could switch off to prevent me from having to ritually slaughter bards.
Khayden
Hehe it's not just invis. How many people don't want brells landing on them? Or SoT, or Virtue, etc. The pet poofing from invis is more annoying than clicking off one buff and re-asking for another, but lots of people have issue with certain things landing on them when they don't want it.
I'd be happy with two switches:-
[ ] Block Ranger buffs
[ ] Block Paladin buffs
QuoteHehe it's not just invis. How many people don't want brells landing on them? Or SoT, or Virtue, etc. The pet poofing from invis is more annoying than clicking off one buff and re-asking for another, but lots of people have issue with certain things landing on them when they don't want it.
Sure, but can you really compare them? Clicking off and recasting one spell takes 10 secs, 250 mana maybe. Resummoning, shrinking, and rebuffing warder takes over a minute and at least 1500+ mana (pet, haste, proc, IoS, regen). If clerics, wizards or enchanters were bugged and lost 1500 mana at random intervals, don't you think it'd be worth fixing?
Instead of telling ourselves why it can't be done (charm, "they'll never do it", etc), why not try? It's an issue that affects every beastlord / pet class and that no pet class would complain about it being fixed if implemented correctly.
(edit: added last paragraph)
"The pet poofing from invis is more annoying than clicking off one buff and re-asking for another"
Like I said in the very quote you quoted it definitely is more annoying and more costly when invis poofs a pet than just swapping buffs around.
"If clerics, wizards or enchanters were bugged and lost 1500 mana at random intervals, don't you think it'd be worth fixing?"
That would be a bug and it would be random. This is very predictable (happens when someone invis's you) and happens because it is supposed to happen (pet poofs when you invis). It's annoying, I honestly wouldn't mind if pets stayed up well invis hit especially with all of the changes, but you simply can't compare a functioning game mechanic like pets poofing when master invis's againist a random "bug" that eats 1500 mana from some other class.
Quote from: Tastian"The pet poofing from invis is more annoying than clicking off one buff and re-asking for another"
Like I said in the very quote you quoted it definitely is more annoying and more costly when invis poofs a pet than just swapping buffs around.
"If clerics, wizards or enchanters were bugged and lost 1500 mana at random intervals, don't you think it'd be worth fixing?"
That would be a bug and it would be random. This is very predictable (happens when someone invis's you) and happens because it is supposed to happen (pet poofs when you invis). It's annoying, I honestly wouldn't mind if pets stayed up well invis hit especially with all of the changes, but you simply can't compare a functioning game mechanic like pets poofing when master invis's againist a random "bug" that eats 1500 mana from some other class.
What would be cool is if you can cast invisibility on your pet first which would be the "trigger" to allow you to invis yourself without losing the pet. Of course this is essentially what Suspend Minion does.
It's very simple really. They just need an option for pet classes called invisibility Spells:
a) Self only
b) Party member
That would solve that problem.
Shere Khaan
The answer is simple and should be instituted easily. Invis should be like being transed. You should have to click yes to allow someone to invis you. Annoying with bard songs maybe (if icon drops you'd have to click again not each time the song pulsed). But beats the crap out of losing pet to idiots. Also should be a setting toggle, "Allow invis without confirmation". That way non pet classes won't have to be bothered clicking yes.
Quote from: XalmatIt will never go away. Thats one of the issues with pets thats intented.
Suspend is the only workaround they will give.
Pets poofing on invis was put in shortly after release to address exploits. Those exploits are no longer possible with pets being beta-neutral and it should be changed back (IMO)
At one point... can't remember if it was in beta or release... you could cast see invis on your pet to block poofing. That made a lot of sense to me, since it required action on the part of the caster to enable it. It was nerfed at some point.
Quote from: Shere KhaanIt's very simple really. They just need an option for pet classes called invisibility Spells:
a) Self only
b) Party member
That would solve that problem.
Shere Khaan has the right idea. This needs to go in the options page. When invis drops while running through GoD, the extra time taken to click "Yes" could very well get me killed.
My point was with both FD and invs - pets used to get agro and you would get no risk exp - that was before beta netrual on pets. Now niether is an issue and the FD nerf has been reversed already. Precedent for making the change for invis is now there.
I know my fathers druid would like not to loose his DC pets on invs.
Charmed pets and DC pets wont zone when regular pets can - after the next patch right? So since they have a different set of rules maybe the invs change we want would not effect charmed pets?
Never say never anymore, the "vision" is dead and I am personally glad to see it go.
To me the logic of the Warder poofing when we Invis is that the Warder can't see us, so it goes back home for some kibble. I think we should be able to keep our Warders if we cast See Invisible on them! If they can see us they should stay by our sides!!!! If SOE thinks that is too powerful they can always make it a high-mana "Pet See Invisible" spell to balance it out.
Hmm ever hear about suspend minion 2 ? , if you need to invis to make a run just supsend pet then bring him out from suspension before you rezone.
Quote from: seravokHmm ever hear about suspend minion 2 ? , if you need to invis to make a run just supsend pet then bring him out from suspension before you rezone.
Sure, but that's a pain going to riwwi now:
click on BB stone
BB: run
say nedaria
Nedaria: say natimbi
Natimbi: suspend - invis - run to zone - unsuspend - zone
Qinimi: suspend - invis - run to zone - unsuspend - zone
Riwwi: suspend - invis - run to camp
Basically, at the moment, I prefer having my pet dying...
Casting See Invis on your pet would be a good fix for this. That way charmers could still break charm.
-Lith
Quote from: seravokHmm ever hear about suspend minion 2 ? , if you need to invis to make a run just supsend pet then bring him out from suspension before you rezone.
Sure I have... but I have more important things to spend my AA's on first. Not everyone is a lvl 65 with a few hundred AA's.... for me, suspend minion is a luxury I won't be able to afford for a while. My point is that players would benefit from that ability at ALL levels, especially those that can't get AA's yet. We have to look at what can be done for EVERYONE, not just the high end members of our class.
:evil:
Grouped on a raid yesterday with a bard who kept playing one of his movement songs that has an invis component. Killed kitty twice before I realized what was happening and smacked him to get his attention. We really need to NOT have pets poof with invis or we should have a consent window so that if we don't want to be invis we don't have to take it.
whats wrong with just having the /pet get lost command break dc charm pets
My biggest problem with suspending and unsuspending all the time is that bug that makes movement rate buffs stop working after a suspend. So everytime I unsuspend him I have to mem SoW and recast it.
I dont say much here, Read the posts a lot and get helpfull information all the time, but dont say much about the concerns posted becouse for a lot of them they dont effect me yet. But with pets poofing with Invis that effects all pet classes at every lvl they can get a pet. And suspend minion is not the answer to fix it, if you think it is then your only looking at the problem as someone who is allready 65 and dont care about any one else. The reason they made pets poof on invis is no longer valid and like Necro FD and Shadowknight FD it should be fixed so pets dont poof anymore when your invis.
I totally agree with you Meemae. What good would supend and invis working for any other bst. Like when I buff up dog in PoK and then head to Dulak. I either have to fight my way thru the tunnel in Gunthak or train everything to the zoneline.
I hate training mobs because I have no idea with trouble I may be causing someone else.
I agree with Meemae too.
Quote from: rhorseI totally agree with you Meemae. What good would supend and invis working for any other bst. Like when I buff up dog in PoK and then head to Dulak. I either have to fight my way thru the tunnel in Gunthak or train everything to the zoneline.
I hate training mobs because I have no idea with trouble I may be causing someone else.
That's why I originally brought it up! I farm the Bloodpriest in Acrylia. To get to him I invis and run past an army of Grimlings. I then bring up my Warder to fight the Minion that can see through Invis. It would be so nice to be able to have my fully buffed Warder up to help incase Invis fades (and it does so all too often). Gunthak is another perfect example of where this is important!
I would be happy if they simply let me zone with a suspended pet. Thats all I need (or want). Then i could simply suspend my pet, invis up and run around wherever I wanted through as many zones as i wish. Simple change. Problem solved.
I don't see the need to de-value this AA which is something many of us worked hard for. If you want the ability to suspend just unlock the Class AA category asap (cost 18 AA) and then buy it for 8 AA's. Why should you get something for nothing that I had to put a lot of effort into obtaining?
Suspend minion is PoP AA. You don't even have to spend points into general to use it. Simply be 62/64 and you can buy.
While a change to the invis rules might "de-value" suspend minion, it would be worth the price to me. The "main" benefit of suspend was originally supposed to be that you could have a "pocket pet" that you could pull out in an emergency if your first pet got destroyed. Saving it from invis was another realized benefit, but that wasn't exactly the reason it was put in. It's especially good for beastlords to have a pocket pet given that it generally takes us more time and energy to get our pets back up to speed.
Being able to invis while having both a suspended pet and a normal one would actually *increase* the value of Suspend Minion during those times when I am in one zone for a long time but I need to invis somewhere. Right now, I can't have an "extra" pet if I know I need to invis, because I need to save the space so I can suspend a pet when needed.
Quote from: a_moss_snake_001I don't see the need to de-value this AA which is something many of us worked hard for. If you want the ability to suspend just unlock the Class AA category asap (cost 18 AA) and then buy it for 8 AA's. Why should you get something for nothing that I had to put a lot of effort into obtaining?
Again, it isn't all about the high end game. We need to look at the effect these things have on EVERYONE.... lvl 1-65... not just what a Lvl 60+ with x-number of AA's can do! I agree with Bengali, it won't devalue it, but increase its benefits.
OK, first: I thought that the reason that pets poof when you invis was due to PvP. I t prevents the exploitation of sicing in pet... then invising so the player can't attack you (unless they can see invis that is).
Second: someone said that invising is the only way to end charm. THis is not true. You can dispell charm. I can take some time and you have to plough through all the other buffs on the mob first but you can dispell charm. Have done it myself.
Tenosh 65 Bard, 48 (almost to a new pet!) BL on prexus.
My guess is that Sony intends to use the suspend minion while zoning AA as a carrot to co erce us into buying the expansion. It's their typical deal... we'll do content for this group of folks but to get everyone to pay for it we'll put in this ability that you must be level 66 to get.
I still can't get past the first zone in GoD. I'm not buying OOW if all they have there for me is carrots. Perhaps they haven't noticed but kitties are carnivores.