Overhaste vs Dbl Attack Totem

[Kanan]

kk.. anyone parsed what is better, an 8% overhaste or the Dbl Attack totem? thinking mostly raid buffed tbh, since solo I'm under 100% haste.

[Inphared]

Why not use both? Unless I'm unaware of a stacking issue, both should help you either way.

[Shamno]

Both come with a regen component I think that makes them not stack, designed that way on purpose if I rememebr right.

[Inphared]

I would go with overhaste then. I don't think the double attack totem is very beneficial at all versus the overhaste.

[Kanan]

guess I'll try to get a parse done up I guess.

What mob do peeps use for parsing now?

[Khauruk]

I would be surprised if the 8% overhaste was less dps compared to double attack totem.

[Nusa]

I would be surprised if the 8% overhaste was less dps compared to double attack totem.

At least for us. For another class that gets a lot more double attack, it might be a different story.

[Pakratz]

IMO it comes down to group setup and buff stacking.  On raids you should always have Predator (4% DA at rank 2 iirc), so the 6% double attack is really only worth 2%.  On the other hand, if you're with a bard, the 8% OH won't stack at all with bard overhaste and is thus worth nada.  So use the OH when bardless, otherwise use the tooth.

I once parsed these 2 clickies in side-by-side 46 minute tests with soloing buffs.  Here's the results:

Test mob= Askr the Lost in BOT, all attacks from the front
Buffs for both tests: Celerity, SV, SE
Stats:  40 CE, 146 Accuracy, 20 Strikethrough
Weapons: MH=Tonfa with Tunat aug, OH=2.0 with + 3 damage aug from DP

Test 1: 46 minutes using 8% OH clicky from Tacvi
Results: Crush 178dps, Punch 205 dps, Procs 18 dps = total of 402 dps (rounded off)


Test 2: 46 minutes using 6% DA clicky
Results: Crush 176dps, Punch 205 dps, Procs 19 dps = total of 401 dps (rounded off)


Taking somewhat of a guess here.....I think the way the math works is that the 8% overhaste is really only worth a 4% boost in dps since you're already at 100% haste.  I can't remember the details - maybe the bard boards have an explanation.  I wonder if DA works sorta the same way, except we're only like 50% DA baseline so we really get like 4% boost out of the 6% DA mod.  Thus they come out to be the same boost????


As an aside, with 20 strikethru mod, strikethrough occured 3.32% in test 1 for 13 dps total and 3.45% in test 2 for 13 dps total.  Might be useful if you're wondering how good strikethru is.  Keep in mind strikethru is worth 0 dps if you're attacking from behind all the time like you usually are on raids.

[Rabekiz]

You can remove the proc DPS from both totals as neither haste nor double attack affect proc rates. Interesting that the main hand weapon shows no change at all in DPS.

I think the way the math works is that the 8% overhaste is really only worth a 4% boost in dps since you're already at 100% haste.

Not sure you are clear here since you are only getting 95-96% haste when buffed with celerity (assuming 45-46% worn haste).

Just looking tat the numbers tho, a 8% overhaste combined with 96% haste is a 8.3% increase while the 6% DA mod to a 50% base DA is a 12% increase overall. Probably why the dps difference is negligible between the two.

Has anyone parsed if the DA familiar actually stacks with predator, they should since they are different slots (at least according to Lucy).

[Nusa]

To determine degree of improvement, you really need a Test 0 parse, using neither clicky.

Slots determine whether the spells actually overwrite/block one another, not whether they stack. % type abilities typically don't stack -- take the largest one in effect and ignore the others. Now if I could just convince shaman's to stop casting Talisman of Celerity during raids (which physically stacks with chanter hastes, but has no additional effect).

[dainfrol]

Now if I could just convince shaman's to stop casting Talisman of Celerity during raids (which physically stacks with chanter hastes, but has no additional effect).

Last night we had a husband and wife pair come join us on our hunting.  He brought his 60-something chanter (cast SoS on the melee classes), then she cast Talisman of Celerity....... you would figure they (sitting in same room) would not do that!

[Rabekiz]

Slots determine whether the spells actually overwrite/block one another, not whether they stack. % type abilities typically don't stack -- take the largest one in effect and ignore the others.

The key word of course being typically, there are however instances where %s actually do stack from multiple buffs/effcts. I'll agree though, I should have used the word "could" vice "should". In either case, the only way to determine if the % effects are stacking would be to parse. Hence my question, has anyone parsed predator + familiar vs predator vs familiar?