Bst Dots - how about make them combat dots

[Choppin]

Idea:

1) slap a big deaggro on them like Roar of Thunder, that counters effectively the aggro part

2) lower the cast time to 1 sec

3) increase the recast time to 15 sec

4) put a slight resist mod on em, maybe neg50

5) up the manacost / reduce number of ticks / more damage per tick

example:

Chimera Blood    
1:  Increase Poison Counter by 18
2:  Decrease HP when cast by 143
3:  Decrease Hitpoints by 200 per tick
 
Mana: 448 Skill: Conjuration
Resist: Poison Casting Time: 4.1
Recast Time: 2.25 Fizzle Time: 2.5
Range: 200 Push Back 0.5
Duration: 7 ticks


new Combat optimized Chimera Blood    
1:  Increase Poison Counter by 18
2:  Decrease HP when cast by 286
3:  Decrease Hitpoints by 400 per tick
5:  Decrease Hate by 1500
 
Mana: 800 Skill: Conjuration
Resist: Poison Resist Adjust -50
Casting Time: 1.0
Recast Time: 15 Fizzle Time: 0.5
Range: 200 Push Back 0
Duration: 3 ticks

[Kebrarn]

400 a tick seems too powerful IMO.  Not to mention I use the dots whenever (not often anymore i supose) I pet kite, so losing agro would suck then.  I do like the idea of a lowered cast time though.  

Overall I think that would be way too powerful in the eyes of SOE.  400 a tick is nasty.  Isn't that on par with shaman dots at this point?

[flush]

The mana cost of that proposed dot solution will offset any "too much damage" argument.

And it's 3 ticks for a total of 1200 damage, overpowering for the level we get those spells?

Look at shaman and necro dot dmg / mana ratios compared to us.

[sierf]

still probably too powerful. and it's an aggro free dot

[Braedan_VZ]

If you notice the mana cost it's nearly doubled to reflect how good a spell this would be.

All other classes dots will need reworked before it sees the light of day but it's a great idea.

Would disease dots last as long as current poison dots?

[Choppin]

I never have dots memmed unless its a totally ranged fight (once in a blue moon, I might be better off nuking and healing there) and I also have alot of unused mana, so now you know where I am coming from.

1) the deaggro value (of my example) doesnt make the spell do no aggro, it just lowers the amount you get, see what tastian wrote about Roar of Tunder

2) given the dmg / mana ratio it (my example) would be quite a drain on mana ressources

3) current dots arent useable if you are meleeing, unless you do very minor dps, so giving up 3 - 5 rounds to cast a a current dot can easily make me loose 1k dmg in melee damage, what was my point in casting the dot at all ?

I see that some people have different play styles and some maybe play their beastlord as a kiter for the most part, however for me that is uneffective and dots have no use soloing nor raiding for me so that whole spellline is quite a complete waste for me at this stage of the game

(SoE adding another two useless (for me) dots in OoW while no new slow makes no sense at all)

[Tastian]

I'd read this before and it's something that has been gone over.  One of the suggestions for addressing chimera blood is adding a -hate component to it like they did to tigirs.  The omens disease dot is simply wrong, it's a shaman spell not a beastlord spell plain and simple.  If festering gets changed to a solid 70th level upgrade to malaria I can see a lot of beastlords using it.  The duration might be a bit longer than needed in some cases, but like chop says there are beastlords atm sitting around at 90+ mana and they can't mem another nuke that is less damage than just melee'n, won't bother with plague and can't risk SV/CB/TB.

[CillianFV]

Hey Tast, what is the aggro like on disease counters and dots vs poison counters and dots?

If they fixed our level 70 disease dot (and our 65 one would be nice too), would that effectively give us a high aggro dot and a low aggro dot and beastlords could choose which one they wanted you use in a given situation?

[Tastian]

Disease counters are basically no aggro.  The actual aggro to damage ratio of a disease dot is decent.  If they changed our level 70 dot to be like malaria and a 9 tick dot doing about the same total damage, it'd be a decent spell.  It wouldn't run duration in some spots, but I'd still have mem'd most of the time.  I'm talking with them and trying to get them all the data atm, hopefully hear something in a bit.  Friday the spells issues will be on the top 10 list, so hopefully that helps.  I'm so busy doing schit I can't seem to find time to talk about it lol.

[Eatbugs]

Disease counters are basically no aggro.

This is true, but wasn't always.  Disease counters were changed to give very little aggro around the time of the original SK aggro nerf and the introduction of disease counters to slows.  Prior to that, Disease Cloud was the best SK aggro spell in most situations, because it gave good aggro for very little mana cost.

Point is, the amount of aggro given disease and poison counters is arbitrary and easily changeable.  Given the difficulty both we and Shaman have using poison DoTs in most situations, it seems to me the aggro on poison counters needs to be changed.

[Tastian]

Yeah I remember lol.  

Overall dots need a lot of work, but FM can actually be made into a reasonable spell lots of beastlords could use by just making a few tweaks to it.  The problem with the spell isn't an aggro problem that requires counter balancing or changes to the counters that would effect other things, it's just that the duration is way too long for beastlords to use.  I really wish they'd given us an upgrade to malaria at 65 now instead of plague.  *shrugs* Hopefully it'll get changed.  Be really nice to actually use dots and get some use out of all those AA points I sunk into CA lol.

[Zurash Kittenclaws]

I like the idea that Chop has suggested. I also never use dots, and the only damaging spell I cast is our cold nuke whenever it manages to refresh. The only way my mana drops in raids is keeping fero up constantly on a few people, nuking as it pops, and occasionally chain healing casters to stop them dying to aoe dots/nukes hehe. :)

A few more useful changes to our spells might see me actually try and keep a rune I win. :)

[Plumps Klo]

Tbh, I would hate it if my dots would no longer generated the aggro they do now. They are such a nifty tool to take aggro off people you don't want aggro on (int casters, healers).

[Choppin]

Plumps Klo I dont know what you are fighting, but the stuff I fight (even the trash) finishes off casters / priests in 1 - 2 rounds, before I have finished casting a dot to take over aggro, they are long dead,

I cast slow to attract their attention cause its fast, if they still dont turn to me I hit prot spirit while sitting down at the same time. (not to mention that a dot makes mezzing a pain)

Also I dont ask for them to change all dots in this fashion, 1 good one would be enough. So you would still have a wide choice of dots for generating aggro.

[CillianFV]

I guess the point I was trying to make was that if they fixed our disease dots to be more like malaria, then beastlord could chose if he wanted to use posion dots for high aggro or disease dots for low agro.  Not the perfect solution but a step in the right direction I think.  It also would not involve taking anything away that beastlords currently use.