My 1st NOTABLE "CONCERN"

[Gourgeous George]

Having read a post in The Campfire regarding SoE position on PoP post Oow release, I was "inspired", for want of a better word, to find out how other people view this issue of opening the middle/higher planes. My first reaction was:

"Eeek shock horror at the thought of them opening up any more of the planar zones!!"

Perhaps some of you can quell my initial Bestial Rage (well I am a Beastlord) with more rational incite into this touchy topic.

All guilds have suffered late nights raiding for flags, wipes and failure over the time PoP has been about. I know from experience that being in an inter-continental guild with leadership heavily balanced to the US contingent, I have had many a long night ending  between 3am and 5am to keep up with flagging raids.

Does it affect my work? Yes
Do I suffer for it? Yes
Will I continue to do it? Yes
Does my RL suffer for it? Yes
Value of the achievement? Priceless!!

When "casual gamers" can tell me they put themselves out in RL, get as little as 90 mins sleep before commuting for 3 hours there and 3 hours back from work or whatever, then I would consider them deserving in having higher tier access. People do have a tendency to harp on about paying the same subscription and therefore are deserving of the same access. It isn't about where the higher level guilds are now, they still invested more than just a few pounds a month for subscription. If I was paid by the hour for the time invested in getting somewhere in EQ with my guildies, based on the cost to business of my time in RL,  I too would be a "casual gamer" given my sudden rise in wealth and the long holidays that it would afford me.

It was nice to get the PoP charm so thanks to SoE. But as we get older in the game and our real lives progress, can you seriously see gimmicks like that as proportionate to the time we lost in game when we could've been doing something else.

Clearly the casual gamer is getting something extra in RL we aren't, if they can't dedicate the same amount of time, despite paying the same taxes. Should WE be asking for a rebate?

And yes, this is spoken like a true addict. I do think RL is greater than EQ, but like many of you oldschool players, I play to keep in touch with the friends I have made over the past 4 or so glorious years of my EQ life.

[Gimrol]

Having read a post in The Campfire regarding SoE position on PoP post Oow release, I was "inspired", for want of a better word, to find out how other people view this issue of opening the middle/higher planes. My first reaction was:

"Eeek shock horror at the thought of them opening up any more of the planar zones!!"

Perhaps some of you can quell my initial Bestial Rage (well I am a Beastlord) with more rational incite into this touchy topic.

Edit:  Found the origional post, adding my thoughts there.

[Koullyn]

Open them up I say. It has been 2 years since the release and the casual gamers have been locked out long enough really. I am biased, I want my 2box to be able to enter and most of the big guilds do not backflag for the elementals anymore. Right now the zones are really under used except for named, gods and the occasional exp group.

[JillieMT]

Open 'em up. EQ should be fun, not a job. And no one, NO ONE who has their flags enjoys backflagging AT ALL. From everyone I have talked to who has advanced to elementals/Time, none of them enjoy doing the backflag grind... but with the decreasing popularity of the game with high end players, it's getting harder and harder to muster the troops for high end planar raids. Almost everyone I have talked to doesn't care anymore if they open up the content.

I mean, what good is your "achievement" if you can't muster enough people to even raid there anymore?

[Zatd]

Does it affect my work? Yes
Do I suffer for it? Yes
Will I continue to do it? Yes
Does my RL suffer for it? Yes
Value of the achievement? Priceless!!

When "casual gamers" can tell me they put themselves out in RL, get as little as 90 mins sleep before commuting for 3 hours there and 3 hours back from work or whatever, then I would consider them deserving in having higher tier access.

Wow - do you and I have a different view of the game.  Nothing wrong with that - just sayin is all.

I posted in the original post as well - my view.  Leave PoP as it is since lots of folks are still working through the content as is.   Revamp the content that nobody touches anymore.  Turn long dead 'raid event's' into 2 groupable doable content.  Ofcourse some of that has been done simply due to mudflation, but still lots of mobs that live extrememly long lives these day because it still requires a mild raid force for family guild equipped folks.

[Grymslade]

While I'm a bit indecisive either way on wether they should open up or not, I look at it this way.

OoW will bring 5 new levels.  After 6 months (probably less) when the majority of folks playing high level content are of level 70, the entry flags needed to get to elementals will become trivial at best.  These flag mobs will be doable by 3-4 groups of level 70 players, which is a meager force to muster.

So in essence, by raising the level limit, they are opening the elemental planes to the public.

However, even with that said, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if they just opened up the elementals all together to the general public.  This is SoE we're talking about here.

[shenker]

It will be a mistake to open them up. It's just inviting people who can't handle the mobs there and I foresee many many trains due to people biting off more than they can chew. Besides I rather not see all the flagging I have done go to waste.

[kitanababe]

I dont like the idea of opening it up. On MT many open raids are done and gives the casual player a chance to become flagged. If you open it up imagine all the people that will miss out on zones and encounters that are such a large part of the experience (good or bad).

[Coprolith]

Does it affect my work? Yes
Do I suffer for it? Yes
Will I continue to do it? Yes
Does my RL suffer for it? Yes
Value of the achievement? Priceless!!

I think they should open up the EPs just to save your soul G.G. If opening up the EPs is the only thing that'll make you give up your EQ addiction and lead a normal life again then im all for it.  :roll:

/hugs

[Strigori]

Enough  is open already.  Opening elementals would be severly detrimental to the game. There SHOULD be a reward for getting all those flags and raiding regularly.  Sorry if that offends the casual guys, but though. You open the higher planes you will lilkly have a mass exodus of the players who HAVE spend countless hours getting there to have thier accomplishments completly devalued.   If you havnt raided through to the Elementals, there is very little chance you will live through 1 pull.  With GoD being largly availible to the casual gamer for most of the content, and with the stated design on OoW being most all zones open to all players, just sealed high end raid areas, there is no reason to open the zones in PoP that are closed.  

Statements from SoE about more people in those zones is simply from how long they have been around, and the fact that raising the level cap will make the encounters easier(like luclin was after PoP came out).  

Simply put leave it alone. They open Elementals, I cancel my account after that patch message.

[Kanne]

Backflagging is a horrible aspect of the game.  How many guilds still do backflagging on a regular basis?  Open raids are pure torture.  A minimum of 2 hours just to get numbers to attempt a target, and then have one person screw it up.  They should open all the elemental planes to 65+.  

There are some great experience zones in sol ro, tactics, earth, and fire.  I mean are the elemenatal planes harder than god?  If casual gamers can handle god, then they can handle the elementals.  

It's time SOE stop making these guys wait to see an expansion they paid for about 2 years ago. At a minimum, they should open up sol ro and tactics.

[Skanda]

At a minimum, they should open up sol ro and tactics.

Go do the PoStorms quest for Tactics access. I did it before I got my MB kill and all it takes is 2 people. Sol Ro should never be opened, once you suffer through the hell that is the Bert event it would break your heart to see that zone ruined by what is currently ruining BoT.

[JillieMT]

OK... after thinking about it today, I change my mind.

Don't open them up.

BUT...

Ease up on the numbers of flags required to bring non-flagged along like I suggested a long time ago! What is it now... 85% of raid has to be flagged? Why not just make it one for one... 15 flagged members can bring along 15 unflagged. So half the raid (50%) has to be flagged. This will keep the progression requirement, but will make backflagging ALOT less painful. Guilds will still have to work for it, but won't be penalized so badly just because all of their flagged people might not be on at any given time.

[Strigori]

I dont mean to offend anyone, but quite frankly, the only proponents of opening the planes are people who have not earned the flags themselves.   DO guilds do alot of backflagging? Nope, why would they? If thier raid force is flagged for a zone, no need to keep doing the backflags.   And honestly, just paying your $13 a month should in no way entitle you to every single aspect of the game.   Otherwise there is very little incentive for the people who play more, for the time, effort and commitment to a guild for getting all these flags, they better remain a locked set of zones. I also dont belive the average non-raider has the skill/gear/whatever to handle the zones. Look at the before and after in BoT(bastion of Trains).  Your lucky if zoning in doesnt get you killed.

[JillieMT]

Strigori: the raid alliance I was involved with was pretty much killed by backflagging. Too many high end players are leaving EQ for other games. There isn't enough high end players coming in to replace the ones who've left. We had a whole thread about this somewhere here...

Unflagged are NOT the only proponents either. Did you read what I said above, or just throw in a post? I know MANY ele/Time flagged people that are SICK of trying to keep up with the losses. When you get one new person in a guild, 2 flagged people are leaving, and they are getting tired of it.

Perhaps no one in your guild has left. Doubtful, but that may be true I suppose. At any rate, eventually your guild will start to fade like the rest have. And then what? OK, you are flagged for Time, but you might not have enough flagged people left to do something with it.