The great debate (mine anyway): Mage or Necro

[Taiglin]

Much context below - bottom line up front: As a non-raiding, family guild Bst I am trying to decide between mage or necro as my third box and looking for input. And yes I think I have read just about every thread talking about this choice on the board :)

I have two boxed a Bst/Dru for a long time now. Got a wild hair and PLed a mage on the dru account. Got him to about 63, went out to hunt, and didn't like it. To be fair to the Bst/Mage boxers out there I should say this guy was PLed in the time frame of afking MMs. Later I got another wild hair and PL/leveled up a necro on my Bst account with the grand idea of kiting the nest, hive, etc for xp and profit. The paradigm switch (kite vs tank) was more then I really wanted to go through so ended up buying a third account. After looking through the boards here and after much anguish and wringing of the hands I split the necro off with the idea of doing Bst/Nec/Dru (or cleric).

My necro just dinged 65. For the last several levels though I have begun to wonder how much I am really getting out of the necro and if I played my mage the same way, against the same types of mobs would I be getting more out of him. I can appreciate a couple of things at this point. Both of these toons aren't 68+ so really I am not seeing the full potential damage (be a long time before they see 69/70 spells). Added to that and perhaps swinging the bar over too far is my hunting has been focused on leveling the necro and cleric so haven't fought in higher level zones so the fights just aren't lasting overly long (swag of say 30-45sec). That said in reasonably fast full groups, at least the ones I have been in recently, the mobs also aren't lasting longer then that. The necro isn't usually casting more then twice and even then the dots aren't running full.

Is it a good assumption to say necro and mage damage is roughly the same with the understanding that the mob needs to last a while before the necro's DoT really do their thing? Having the mage's damage basically front loaded would seem to cut the fight length down a good bit over the necro. I think I would use CoH more often then FD and while having the necro rez on tap is nice I have only used it a handful of times thus far. Necro mana regen is really a think of beauty and by far takes the least amount of time to get back on her feet after a death + no need of KEI is really a nice perc.

Anyway, it is getting late and this is already about 4 times longer then I figured. If you strip away the extras and just look at damage am I cutting the necro short? It looks like their spells really ramp up damage/tick wise and would get better with AAs. It does seem to boil down to personal preference but looking for folks who have maybe gone through the same decision or have input from playing both/either classes.

Sorry to have rambled :)

[bham]

I would go Beast, mage, cleric, but Im biased. (check magelo)

Mala, tough pet, solid nukes, handy summoned items, CoTH (coolest spell in the game that doesnt kill things).

I recently added a 5th toon (the warrior) but still only have 4 machines, so I have to drop either the mage or the wizard. For mindless grinding I keep the wizard (he needs the AA more) but for challenging content I take the mage every time.

Having said that Ive never played a necro. Altho I have grouped with a raid geared necro many times and he's a powerhouse.

[Bulge]

I had both a Mage and Necro in my 6-box, both level 65 and they both bring a lot to the table.
First off, I never have fully developed my potential with the Mage when it comes to off-tanking stuff or CoTH pulling so you better listen to Bham for that. My Mage was a Nuker, debuffer at times, pet-damage and Pet toys.

I probably did use my Necro more to it's fullest potential, and by this I mean her unbelievable potential to regain mana and give this back to the group through Mind Wrack. I must add right away that I mostly played my 6 box in DoN missions, and a LOT of the DoN mobs are susceptible to Mind Wrack, so this is a bit skewed: in an old fashioned dungeon with  few casters you will use this a lot less. But in DoN, each and every mob got Mind Wracked, making for an extra 300 mana per mob for each of my toons. This is how I was able to start to nuke the hell out of mobs more and more, even with all my other toons (Druid, Chanter, BL and even Cleric nuked). I am not saying that this is an efficient way to play, but the amount of mana available to my hydra was immense, and basically I used nuking as CC. It is also fun to see mobs die fast like that.

I also had a hotkey that would send in the Necro pet and immediately throw Funeral Pyre on it: this is a fast DoT and I think it ran for full most of the time. I never had aggro issues with dotting so fast, I guess BL's are really good at keeping aggro. :) I was planning on trying to throw that super fast Curse in there too, but never came to that level. Probably would have gotten some aggro issues then. Also, because my Necro had so much mana, I nuked with her posion nukes a LOT. Not efficient, but together with the Mana she made for the group, I consider her more DPS then a Wizard in that respect. After all, she was giving 1500 mana to my group every mob, which is hard to beat by even a 3-5k nuke from a Wizzie. I guess if you have a group with just a Warrior and Cleric, then Mind Wrack is not nearly as usefull as it was with my group.

I *never* used FD on my Necro. I simply always forgot about it, or never had to use it, since I had no aggro issues yet. Maybe if I would have  started thrwoing in another DoT I would have used it, but I was much more happy having her standby to Mind Wrack stuff, then over-dotting  and be worried about aggro.

Anyway, I realize that I have not gotten the true potential out of my 6-box group so far, but I found that botting a necro was easier then I would have imagined, and the Mana is just yummy if you have nukers in your hydra.

My personal conclusion: for a large Hydra (4+) I would probably prefer a Necro, but for 3 or less, I would take a Mage.

[recoil silverclaws]

ive started two boxing my bst necro box a lot more now sence my necro has gotten some prity respectable gear and have to say its a prity potent combo much better then i was expecting, the pure fact that necro can mind flay then thro 3-6 dots depending on the mob then just FD and not pull agro even tho the dots are doing major damg is insane and if it hits the fan with none summoning mobs can allways snare and kite or root park (alltho necro root kinda sucks but still possable) or FD and run recoil to the zone lol witch i had to do to day a few times /sigh

[Taiglin]

Hey guys just wanted to thank you for your insight. I still can't quite make up my mind lol. One thing that is in the necro's favor is their mana regen is really a thing of beauty. Last night in NC my necro was dropping 3 Dots and a mink wrack or nuke every other mob or so and I couldn't run her dry. In fact one of the first "real" AAs I planned to get for her was the 9th spell slot so I could put another DoT in there.

As to my original swag of 30-45 sec I should ammend that to say in a full group or older content. Fights last night in NC with Bst/Nec/Clr lasted 1min+/-. Am not sure how much that swings my original question and am still of the impression that assuming a mage and necro does the same amount of damage in a group the fight with the mage will be shorter which would be of benefit to the Bst.

[Thaeliun]

I have a solid BST/Mage/Cleric 3 box.  All 70 and the mage is lowest in AAs with 250 or so.  It's a great 3 box but that's not why I posted.  I really enjoy all 3 classes but I have a few friends that play 70 clerics as well.  There were times when my cleric was not needed and overall under-utilized.  So I leveled up a necro on that account.

My necro is now level 68, (only 11 aas) and has proven to be a lot of fun.  In a group setting where I box mage/bst/necro my 3 box is putting out an amazing amount of DPS.  On incoming mage and necro both throw a resist debuff, (mala and scent of terris).  Neither of these out-agro bst slow.  Necro throws 30 second dot for 3k and mage nukes for 3 k.  Necro MWs, mage nukes again....on the off-chance that the mob isn't dead or running the necro always has enough mana to toss a quick posion nuke.

I'm really glad I don't have to choose.  The options I have now let me stay flexible.  I will say though, the necro adds extra options that the mage does not.  (I hate the sound of that because mage's really rock too)  Still, my 68 necro with poor gear can solo things that my mage/bst/cleric can't handle.

Oh, my original main was a druid which is also on the mage account.  When I was PLing necro, sometimes I would play the necro as if soloing while the bst/druid watched, (bst and druid were not grouped).  When the necro got a mob to 70% or so the bst and druid would add some dots and bst pet would take up the chase.  This has proven to be an effective way to hunt some things I couldn't otherwise kill.  Lol, I'm not claiming to have invented the 3 box kite group but I don't think I've talked to anyone that does it.

[Taiglin]

Thaelium I shot you a message. Doing the Bst/Mage/Necro is an option with the way my accounts are configured but I hadn't mentally gone down that path (till now). I am guessing with things like growl, potions, life tap weapons, etc help cover healing but it sounds like you really haven't done that trio as just the trio in an xp setting. I too find the cleric I am leveling beside my necro to be underutilized and if it wasn't the intent to have my cleric be the ~backup guild cleric for our small family sized guild my plan has been to switch in the Druid. At this stage of the game and with the amount of AAs on my Bst (~600), amount on the Druid (~180), Bsts hp, etc the Druid provides more then enough healing and everything then else the class brings to the table.

Thanks for the post.

[Thaeliun]

I have played the Bst/mage/necro as a trio in limited situations.  I guess I never really pushed the envelope though.  Mostly I played where a 70 bst can solo and just enjoyed the added speed the necro and mage brought to the table.  If I want to

Sorry I don't have a magelo but I can tell you that your gear is quite a bit better then mine.  Still I would like to see how you fare in MPG with BST tanking and druid healing.  I know that some people here with exceptional gear are able to handle it and even RSS without difficulty but I'm not sure where the cutoff for that is, (somewhere above my gear/ability level no doubt).

A BST with gear as good as Bodegah could probably take full advantage of that trio just about anywhere.