65 LDON Hard Questions

Ukator Iceblood · January 05, 2004, 09:49:30 PM

I've tried one or two of these so far, and have a few questions. First how close to Sol Ro/Elemental xp can these be? From what I've read the mobs are around the same levels, is the xp comparable? Without a CCer should this even be tried?

The people I would be trying these with are about as equiped as I am (no VT, some Ssra level). If we tried it it wouldn't be just to gain points, the hard items would be upgrades for us.

Thanks for any responses.

Sempai · January 05, 2004, 10:20:04 PM

I have only done LDoN hard with Time equipped people so take my view accordingly.

The mobs in LDoN on a 65 hard mission hit fairly hard, but also have very low hit points. This makes them somewhat harder and easier than Sol Ro / EP mobs.

In LDoN, the trash hit for about 900 but they die very quickly to a good group. Generally, we will not try one unless we have some form of CC, as this makes it easier to have the mission be a success.

I still believe that the best group experience in the game can be found in the Fire or Earth, but LDoN is still good enough to be a solid use of time.

I think a solid group at the ssra level would be able to do this, but you would have to bring your A game. Even with my guildies, if we get sloppy on LDoN Hard, we will wipe.

Argach · January 06, 2004, 01:43:22 AM

LDoN hard is like 1 hour per AA (assuming completing the mission in 60 min), while PoFire kiting is 30-45 min per AA and PoEarth is 45-60 min per AA, in the few groups I've been in. LDoN hard is harder, since CC is so important, one way or another, and you have a time limit, but I haven't lost any of my 12 adventures. Never tried it without an enchanter, cleric or a plate tank - multiple 990 hitters on a pull brings back the good old pre-PoP CT trip feeling.

I've tanked in PoE and I feel LDoN mobs have pretty close the same dps, but while in PoE I didn't mind tanking since all we got was singles, in LDoN hard a few unslowed adds would just smear me on the floor.

So... I'd say LDoN hard is doable with Ssra level gear, assuming skilled, alert CCer, cleric and tank, some FT on casters, tank 7k+ at least and close to optimal group. -_-

Lascaris · January 06, 2004, 02:14:17 AM

Did a LDON hard yesterday, first time. Finished in 40 minutes. Had Warrior (8.8Kish), rogue (mith marr/bot weapon), bard, cleric, shaman and beastlord (me). We're sol ro flagged but not elemental, no vt, no ssra drops. We did an EC, easiest ldon dungeon imo, and it went very smoothly.

Tenal · January 06, 2004, 03:35:32 PM

Our groups usually use a bard in place of the chanter.

Like the previous poster said, you definitely got to bring your "A" game.

The groups we bring are Elemental flagged, but lacking the true elemental gear at this time. Our average time for adventure completion is 60 minutes. When we get close to last piece we typically send an eye out or use bard tracking to search for named before looting last piece to give us some extra time. We also only do collections.

Tastian · January 07, 2004, 01:12:39 PM

I haven't done many hard missions in awhile, but here's some random stuff from when I used to do them. One of the biggest problems I see in a lot of "hard" LDoN groups is being to heavily tipped toward either defense or offense. The mobs hit 990(ish), all mitigate slow that I've ever seen and have a fair amount of hps for those that are used to easy missions.

Paci get's resisted a lot and I've come to rely a lot more on mez/root/etc for CC as I've seen way too many clerics buy it on a pull and hit spots where the bard basically gave up after eating a few deaths and just brought 2-4 hehe.

Enchanters can actually add just sick dps if they are willing. I know a couple enc that have/will keep a pet for basically the entire mission and if you have an enchanter that is capable of such a thing then it allows you to go a bit heavier on the defense if needed and still have more than enough dps to get the mission done in time.

Finally, you mention loot and I just have to mention that I currently still wear a mask from a Tak hard mission. 90hps regen 2, some stats/saves/etc. It's quite nice. This mission we killed maybe half a dozen monsters (one of which was the named). Basically after the group realized they had no prayer at all of winning or even living through most pulls everyone was sitting around rez'n and meding and I started popping out eyes and scouting around. Half a dozen rooms in, past a bunch of mobs that did *NOT* see invis I saw a named totally solo in a hallway. We finished meding, invis'd up, ran over, killed, lotto'd and then headed out. Just saying that if you really are looking at it as a way of upgrading, if you happen to find yourself down on time and no chance of winning having a rogue go off scouting or wizzy or whoever you still might be able to a decent drop out of the mission.

Voidstalker · January 07, 2004, 09:53:02 PM

Quote from: Ukator IcebloodI've tried one or two of these so far, and have a few questions. First how close to Sol Ro/Elemental xp can these be? From what I've read the mobs are around the same levels, is the xp comparable? Without a CCer should this even be tried?

The people I would be trying these with are about as equiped as I am (no VT, some Ssra level). If we tried it it wouldn't be just to gain points, the hard items would be upgrades for us.

Thanks for any responses.

Elemental exp is much better. Hard LDON it's closer to Solro exp

No, I do not recommend without real cc ex: bard, enc . Not saying it can't be done but there is just less room for error. 1 bad pull, pathing, ...anything and someone dies.

As long as everyone is 65 it's worth a shot. Just make a solid group without any gimps.

ex: war, clr, enc, bst, evac, dps

Ukator Iceblood · January 07, 2004, 09:58:57 PM

No gimps? Darn I can't go then:(

Voidstalker · January 07, 2004, 11:24:14 PM

You know what I mean 8)

Ukator Iceblood · January 08, 2004, 12:32:44 AM

Aye :)

chuteshock · January 11, 2004, 08:43:31 AM

For hard LDON you definetely need CC of some type. My typical hard setup for a group is a tank with 8500hp+, a good cleric, shaman, bard, me and another dps. I don't know if I would take a tank with lower than those HP but I heard wars can tank hard with less after the patch that gave them a mitigation boost. As a beastlord on hard preslow is your friend and works awesome. Especially if you have a multi-pull because it gives the CC/slower time to get things under control without generally having to worry about aggro.

Soriis · January 11, 2004, 03:28:19 PM

Well I'm not elemental flagged, but have done a couple of high risk guk adventures.
For me, I can compare the exp to BoT, it was about the same per kill, roughly 3% AA. The mobs hit like Kriegers but dont have the insane hitpoints.

It's a great place to go for exp, especially if you dont care about your win/loss ratio. The group I was with were all elemental+ equipped, hell the enchanter had more unbuffed hitpoints than I did fully buffed.

Ukator Iceblood · January 16, 2004, 03:34:57 AM

Tried this finally last night. We didn't have any CC but figured what the heck. Group was BST, CLR, WAR, DRU, SHA, and RNG. We tried to root adds or seconds. It was very fun, a failure but very fun:) Next time we do it I will bring a chanter or at least a FDer. Its wild for a guy in a pre Ssra guild *pretty much* to fight mobs that for 900 each.

Is Rujarkian the best spot to try these? Always seems to be less mobs, or they are spread out.

Mahes · January 16, 2004, 08:17:10 PM

Ruj is ok, but there's that one map...I can't recall the name, but if you get it you're hosed. There's a few spots on it with multiple, i.e. 6+, pulls. Nasty map.

If you want to play with hard and get your feet wet, I'd recommend Mistmoore. The pulls there are very easy.

I've only done about...15 or so hard, but my ideal setup would be me, cleric, bard, any of the 3 plate tanks, and 2 dps. Bards are the best damn pullers/CC I've seen on hard runs and my slow is sufficient assuming the cleric and tank are well geared. For the other two dps, I'd probably prefer monks. High dps and not situational.

I've tried tanking a hard before and while it's doable....it's rather ugly. :P

Ghoat · January 22, 2004, 04:10:00 PM

Don't forget if you dont have a chanter/bard can use a mage/necro for cc if you are in the proper theme. Did a Butchblock the other night with only a necro for cc (and not much there is flagged undead, just a little) so we had to do a bit of rooting - monk/bst/cleric/sk/necro/mage. I got wacked, the SK got wacked twice, but we finished with a win.

Personally I am still torn, as far as LDoN points if a hard is worth is, since with that same group we prolly could have done 2 normals in that time - kinda a toss up, aside from better aug drops.