The Beastlords' Den

Everquest 1 => Sony Beastlord Correspondent Information => Topic started by: Tadenea on November 25, 2009, 08:33:27 PM

Title: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Tadenea on November 25, 2009, 08:33:27 PM
AA's

General AA's
Combat Agility 29-33
Combat Stability 29-33
General Sturdiness 11-15
Mystical Attuning 8-12
Quick Draw 3


Archtype AA's
Burst of Power 5-6
Companion's Blessing  7-9
Companion's Durability  7-9
Critical Affliction 7-9
Enhanced Aggression  21-25
Expansive Mind  21-25
Finishing Blow  19-21
Fury of Magic 10-12
Healing Adept 10-12
Healing Gift  19-21
Mental Clarity  19-23
Mental Stamina 6-10
Mnemonic Retention 3-4
Persistent Casting  7-9
Weapon Affinity  7
(New) Divine Companion Aura
(The gods empower you to render your pet invulnerable for a short period of time)
(New) Gift of Amazing Exquisite Radiant Mana
(New) Gift of Exquisite Radiant Mana
(New) Gift of Mana 1-3
(New) Gift of Radiant Mana
(All Mana type AA listed above give innate chance your next spell casted will only cost 1 point of Mana, each rank increases the Levels of spells that can effect this)
(New) Group Perfected Levitation
(This ability grants you a perfected ability to Levitate on demand)
(New) Hastened Companion's Blessing 1-3
(This ability decreases the amount of time required between uses of Companion's Blessing by 60 seconds per rank)
(New) Hastened Forceful Rejuvenation 1-3
(This ability decreases the amount of time required between uses of Forceful Rejuvenation by 5% per rank)
(New) Hastened Mass Group Buff 1-3
(This ability decreases the amount of time required between uses of Mass Group Buff by ten percent per rank)
(New) Spell Casting Mastery 1-3
(This ability gives you a chance to lower the mana cost for the spell by 2, 5, and 10 percent)
(New) Spell Casting Subtlety 1-3
(After training in this ability, NPCs will notice your magical activities 5, 10, and 20 percent less)

Class AA's
Attack of the Warders 4-6
Beastial Alignment 4
Beastial Frenzy 11-13
Bite of the Asp 2
Companion's Agility 4-6
Destructive Fury 4-6
Feral Swipe 5
Focused Paragon of Spirit 7-9
Gorilla Smash 2
Hastened Feral Attacks 4-6
Paragon of Spirit 14-16
Raven's Claw 2
Roar of Thunder 13-15
Sturdy Companion 4-6
Taste of Blood 4
Warder's Alacrity 18-20
(New) Focus of Animus 1-3
(This ability, when active, increases the chance that your poison and disease spells will land on your target. Additional ranks increase your chance of success with these spells)
(New) Improved Natural Invisibility
(This ability allows your target to quickly disappear from sight for a short time)
(New) Nature's Salve 1-3
(This ability, when active, cures detrimental effects from you and your warder. Additional ranks increase the potency of the cure)
(New) Prolific Minion 1-3
(This ability grants your pet the ability to proc short duration swarm pets. Each rank increases the chance to proc)
(New) Protection of the Warder 1-3
(This ability, when active, provides you with protection from melee attacks. Additional ranks increase the total amount of damage absorption per hit that you are afforded)
(New) Tactical Mastery 1-3
(Each rank of this ability grants an increasing chance of bypassing an opponent's special defenses, such as dodge, block, parry, and riposte)
(New) Twinproc 1-3
(passive ability will give you the innate chance to perform a twinproc each time you proc a direct damage spell. Each rank will give you a 2% chance to perform a twinproc)
(New) Extend Group Bestial Alignment 1-3
(Increased Duration by 1 tick per rank)

Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Tadenea on November 25, 2009, 09:07:39 PM
Spells: Some might be changing so not going to post exact info
Basically getting (Lucy Data is little outdated)

#1 Animalistic Intervention (http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spell.html?id=19727&source=Live)
Cast on NPC, and benefit spell gets cased on PC
(Last I knew it was Slow and Ferocity)

#2 Friendly Pet (http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spell.html?id=19736&source=Live)
Defensive Proc for Pet which heals Pet


#3 Haergen's Feralgia (http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spell.html?id=22501&source=Live)
Pet Offense Buff
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Khauruk on November 25, 2009, 09:17:38 PM
Animalistic Intervention is dead - replacement spell is poison/cold nuke.

60% the power of SoD Bite and cold nukes.
50% the mana cost
10% extra agro.
0.8 sec cast (I think)
4.5 sec recast.

The other two are up for significant retuning still before they go live, as they're currently useless.

For AAs, Focus of Animus is now passive as well.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Sikkem on November 25, 2009, 09:46:26 PM
Thanks for the info Tadenea it is much appreciated   8-)
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Catnip_Inny on November 25, 2009, 10:12:38 PM
Pretty sure Prolific Minion is dead as well! something about it causing too much lag...
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Sharrien on November 25, 2009, 10:16:48 PM
Quote from: Catnip_Inny on November 25, 2009, 10:12:38 PM
Pretty sure Prolific Minion is dead as well! something about it causing too much lag...

No!!!!  Make it work!
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Sikkem on November 26, 2009, 02:12:12 AM
Quote from: Catnip_Inny on November 25, 2009, 10:12:38 PM
Pretty sure Prolific Minion is dead as well! something about it causing too much lag...
Well there goes the only AA I was even mildly excited about  :-(

Is it possible to try and get Focus of Animus to work for cold instead of disease or do most blord's use disease dots a lot these days?

Can anyone see any reason for us to get all the lower levels of Gift of Mana to get to the one that is appropriate for level 85 and if so what spell would you use it with?
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Khauruk on November 26, 2009, 03:25:08 AM
Prolific minion pets had a problem - they could end up attacking you.  They don't have a way in game to assign an owner to them, since they're spawned by a pet, rather than by you.  So, they became a real problem.

Animus is a huge improvement over it's first incarnation - 1.5 minutes activated (took a buffslot) every 10 minutes.  I do cast disease dots a good bit in raid targets now, and disease isn't debuffed as much as other resists now iirc.  It won't be an amazing AAl, but it will be decent passive one to buy later on.

Gift of Mana - we were expecting a spell designed for GoM procs like mages, necros, wizards, druids, etc have, but none were coded for any hybrid.  So, it will simply be something to let us use a bit less mana occasionally.  Not as useful w/ the insane gear this expansion though lol.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Nusa on November 26, 2009, 04:20:20 AM
The list of AA's from Tadnea looks nearly identical to the list seen in eqplayers months ago and identical to what's there now. Only differences I see are Hastened MGB moved from class to archetype, and Extended Group BA appeared.

Whats the recast time on Natures Salve? I like that one a lot.

Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: kharthai on November 26, 2009, 04:40:00 AM
Pretty sure Nature's Salve recast is 1 min, but I might be wrong.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Sikkem on November 26, 2009, 06:28:45 AM
Quote from: Khauruk on November 26, 2009, 03:25:08 AM
Animus is a huge improvement over it's first incarnation - 1.5 minutes activated (took a buffslot) every 10 minutes.  I do cast disease dots a good bit in raid targets now, and disease isn't debuffed as much as other resists now iirc.  It won't be an amazing AAl, but it will be decent passive one to buy later on.

Yeah it sounds a lot better than what was originally posted on the eq forums. I only play group eq these days and no longer raid so the only spells I use that benefit from Animus will be Asp and our poison nuke. So its a nice AA but cold would most likely make it better for all beastlords. Glad one section will at least get full use out of it though  :-)

Thanks to all the beta blords also, if it's been anything like other betas you will need a holiday about now  :evil:

Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Hzath on November 26, 2009, 07:59:03 AM
So I can talk about beta stuffs now?
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Karve on November 26, 2009, 09:17:13 AM
Quote from: Hzath on November 26, 2009, 07:59:03 AM
So I can talk about beta stuffs now?

Yes mate, you can.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Hzath on November 26, 2009, 11:27:34 AM
Overall I would say the best thing to come out of beta for us is the pet defensive revamp.  The different is absolutely amazing.  Would have been nice to see these changes prior to the expansion launch, but at least we got them.

Our best spell by far is Frozen Venom (the 60% cold/poison nuke damage for 50% mana with added agro).  It has a 4.5 recast, but that's to ensure we don't just stop using our dots and cold nukes.  The bad part about this spell is it's more mana efficient than all of our other nukes which makes it very appealing to cast, but the additional agro will be way too much for a lot of tanks.  Spell casting subtlety will help, but with no real reliable jolt we'll get to have fun adjusting.  Don't misunderstand my pessimism, it's a wonderful spell.

Our defensive pet defensive heal proc spell is really lame, and the Haegren's Feralgia is bugged.  Hopefully they both get worked into a useful state by launch.

Hastened feral attacks = win.  Recast down to 9 seconds now.

Only a few ranks of BF and Burst of power and no flurry AAs, definitely helpful but so few ranks is saddening.

Fury of magic and Destructive Fury - useful for sure

Prolific Minion - be happy it got pulled.  So many pets would have been terrible on raids - and TONS of classes had this at first.  It was funny telling your warder to get lost and his pets started fighting you though.

Paragons - group paragon got a fair boost in power, up to 1150hp/650mana (i think) at max rank.  No such luck on focused paragon, it's getting 20hp/8mana for each of the 3 ranks.  With gear gaining something like 30% hp/mana this is weak upgrade will probably be noticed once we get newer gear.


Something I haven't seen mentioned yet is our BP.  It now has a focus of decreasing the recast on Emp Fury (not particularly fond of it, but it's not terrible).  The proc is now a proc for ourselves (short duration window) and our warder, with the warder buff also being a HoT.  It's pretty nice (the proc, not the HoT).
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Brane on November 26, 2009, 01:29:10 PM
No new spell slots? That was the thing which interested me the most.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Tadenea on November 26, 2009, 02:15:14 PM
Quote from: Brane on November 26, 2009, 01:29:10 PM
No new spell slots? That was the thing which interested me the most.

Look under Archtype its there
Mnemonic Retention 3-4

2 new spell slots
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Sindaar on November 26, 2009, 04:40:57 PM
Some nice things there..
Out of curiosity how much of an increase are the Beastial Frenzy 11-13? same as the previous ones?

Cheers,
Mubu
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: rhaug on November 26, 2009, 04:58:30 PM
too bad no shortening of recast timers on yowl spell
mages got that for there rs servant. and increased duration.

wonder how we do in the dps department, my opinion is that there isnt anything really outstanding for us in this new expansion. not much love for us.
its more the usual upgrades of aa. the aggro aa is ok, but nice if it can be turned on or off.

hope the new nuke is ok, and radiant mana gifts etc, but did not go oom much in a  raid during burns.
happy that the pet can tank better, hope its dps is also increased in the same way.
since i am more a raider so dps is what it adds for me.

where is the love for the beastlord from the eq developers?
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Bumkus on November 27, 2009, 04:04:48 AM
we should be ok on dps.  Frozen Venom will be a big help in burns assuming it doesnt kill us from aggro.  will be worth getting SCS now if you were on the fence.

Focus of animus will help dots stick better.

hastened feral swipe takes that recast down to 9 sec.

we should also see an improvement in monk/bst ratios

Our warders will have a DA, which is the closest thing we've see to a get out of jail free card lately

Warder dps is stagnated, but we wont have to spend as much time to keep it alive.  I think they want to see how everything shakes out before making more dps adjustments.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: bobokatt1970 on November 28, 2009, 01:03:55 PM
Not a huge thing but noted other classes (at least casters) got an increase to Armor or Wisdom (ac increase).  Was this an omission for hybrids?
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: AbyssalMage on November 29, 2009, 12:19:00 AM
Quote from: Hzath on November 26, 2009, 11:27:34 AM
Overall I would say the best thing to come out of beta for us is the pet defensive revamp.  The different is absolutely amazing.  Would have been nice to see these changes prior to the expansion launch, but at least we got them.
Its about time, but getting this as an expansion release and not something that is patched kinda stinks.  But I'll take it.

Quote from: Hzath on November 26, 2009, 11:27:34 AM
Our best spell by far is Frozen Venom (the 60% cold/poison nuke damage for 50% mana with added agro).  It has a 4.5 recast, but that's to ensure we don't just stop using our dots and cold nukes.  The bad part about this spell is it's more mana efficient than all of our other nukes which makes it very appealing to cast, but the additional agro will be way too much for a lot of tanks.  Spell casting subtlety will help, but with no real reliable jolt we'll get to have fun adjusting.  Don't misunderstand my pessimism, it's a wonderful spell.
Guess we'll have to place Asp/Smash/Raven's on this hotkey to drop the 10% agro increase...I like it as long as it isn't linked to our ice/poison nukes...4 near-insta cast nukes is NICE!

Quote from: Hzath on November 26, 2009, 11:27:34 AM
Our defensive pet defensive heal proc spell is really lame, and the Haegren's Feralgia is bugged.  Hopefully they both get worked into a useful state by launch.
Anything to help the pet live is awesome...Or is the stacking an issue with Hobble/Pet Slow?

Quote from: Hzath on November 26, 2009, 11:27:34 AM
Hastened feral attacks = win.  Recast down to 9 seconds now.

Only a few ranks of BF and Burst of power and no flurry AAs, definitely helpful but so few ranks is saddening.

Fury of magic and Destructive Fury - useful for sure
Probably limiting the amount of DPS we do but DPS is DPS...we just need to ask for more.

Quote from: Hzath on November 26, 2009, 11:27:34 AM
Prolific Minion - be happy it got pulled.  So many pets would have been terrible on raids - and TONS of classes had this at first.  It was funny telling your warder to get lost and his pets started fighting you though.
They could of made this a short (or long duration) buff that allowed us to "proc" pets with out needing an augment or proc in our weapon(or a pet).  I hope some one on the Beta could bring this back as a personal buff  :-D  As far as "too many pets" during a raid...Lets get some love for the groupers and Solo'ers  :lol:
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: AbyssalMage on November 30, 2009, 03:41:04 AM
http://necrotalk.com/showthread.php?t=10888&page=2 (http://necrotalk.com/showthread.php?t=10888&page=2)

Looking at their webpage and noticed they had more info on Mob's in the new expansion.  If this goes live, this expansion looks like another GoD expansion...

Whats worse is the player base is already small and we can't afford another exodus.  Really hope some Beta testers can shed some light on this expansion cause having no "true camps" + requiring groups + requiring the holy trinity of Tank/Cleric/Chanter from days gone bye = Instant death for this expansion and any enjoyment I would of gotten from it.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Sharrien on November 30, 2009, 02:48:17 PM
Well, raids have already dealt with large numbers of pets, all the long-established swarm and rage pets and more recently with all the fabled pet weapons in heavy use this last year.  Raids did just fine even with bunches of pets running around, I bet they would have done just fine with prolific minion as well.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Kanan on November 30, 2009, 03:22:34 PM
One questions I've not seen an answer to here yet: does Frozen Venom share a timer with any of our existing spells?  i.e., did we just gain a 4th nuke to add to our bite/cold/cold nuke lineup?

I know i'll likely be throwing it at the end of the lineup, cuz, yeah.. with existing agro issues from bite, throwing that immediately before/after would be flat dumb unless we're tanking.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: kharthai on November 30, 2009, 03:30:53 PM
Quote from: Kanan on November 30, 2009, 03:22:34 PM
One questions I've not seen an answer to here yet: does Frozen Venom share a timer with any of our existing spells?  i.e., did we just gain a 4th nuke to add to our bite/cold/cold nuke lineup?

It is on its own 4.5 sec timer, separate from the 2 ice nukes and poison nuke.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: AbyssalMage on November 30, 2009, 05:07:10 PM
Quote from: kharthai on November 30, 2009, 03:30:53 PM
Quote from: Kanan on November 30, 2009, 03:22:34 PM
One questions I've not seen an answer to here yet: does Frozen Venom share a timer with any of our existing spells?  i.e., did we just gain a 4th nuke to add to our bite/cold/cold nuke lineup?

It is on its own 4.5 sec timer, separate from the 2 ice nukes and poison nuke.
And lets make sure it stays that way!
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Kanan on November 30, 2009, 06:25:51 PM
cool.. i think that is going to allow us to pretty much truly be chain casting our 5 main spells, constantly with the occasional dot thrown in for good measure.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Catnip_Inny on November 30, 2009, 06:59:21 PM
Frozen Venom has a significant aggro increase with it... the dmg isnt all that great really its more of an aggro tool i find.... Its refresh rate is rediculously short... i can cast FV, throw another nuke and by that time FV will have repopped...

I think this is (I hope) sony's way of addressing a large portion of the bst community who said they will never touch the Spell Casting Subtlety AA's...  though we cant turn Spell Casting Subtlety  on/off... if we chain cast FV we should be able to effectively hold aggro ...

I bought all 3 ranks of Spell Casting Subtlety  last night and tried taking aggro from the warrior in my group, and i actually had to try pretty hard to steal aggro but it was still doable if i got the jump on him lol...

With FV the way it is i might purchase Spell Casting Subtlety now since I usually get tooo much aggro on raids but was unwilling to just throw it away before, because we need ways to control aggro in different situations.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: wildwaters on November 30, 2009, 07:25:30 PM
Quote from: Catnip_Inny on November 30, 2009, 06:59:21 PM
Frozen Venom has a significant aggro increase with it... the dmg isnt all that great really its more of an aggro tool i find.... Its refresh rate is rediculously short... i can cast FV, throw another nuke and by that time FV will have repopped...

I think this is (I hope) sony's way of addressing a large portion of the bst community who said they will never touch the Spell Casting Subtlety AA's...  though we cant turn Spell Casting Subtlety  on/off... if we chain cast FV we should be able to effectively hold aggro ...

I bought all 3 ranks of Spell Casting Subtlety  last night and tried taking aggro from the warrior in my group, and i actually had to try pretty hard to steal aggro but it was still doable if i got the jump on him lol...

With FV the way it is i might purchase Spell Casting Subtlety now since I usually get tooo much aggro on raids but was unwilling to just throw it away before, because we need ways to control aggro in different situations.

This won't happen with an sk >.<

I am curious does anyone know how much the hate isoff the new nuke?
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Mardag on November 30, 2009, 08:55:47 PM
Sounds like the spell would be perfect for soloers like me.  I usually spend most of my time soloing with the occassional groupmate so keeping agro is nice.  Anyone know what level the spell is?  I leveled to 83 and plan to stay there for another 600 AA or so.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Khauruk on November 30, 2009, 08:56:09 PM
3503 per cast (I'm guessing rk2).  It's 110% of the damage values on the parts.

I did a quick 1 minute simulation on a spreadsheet of how much it would boost our agro, and it was an additional 35,000 hate per minute on a burn.  This was before the recast timer was added, so I'm going to pull a number of something like 20,000 added hate/minute out of my butt.  That's after SCS.

The recast timer went in probably to control the huge dps boost we'd get from it (we're already getting a pretty damn good melee boost from AAs/ratios too), and it does, though proably not intentionally, give bst a reason to buy SCS.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Khauruk on November 30, 2009, 08:56:57 PM
Quote from: Mardag on November 30, 2009, 08:55:47 PM
Sounds like the spell would be perfect for soloers like me.  I usually spend most of my time soloing with the occassional groupmate so keeping agro is nice.  Anyone know what level the spell is?  I leveled to 83 and plan to stay there for another 600 AA or so.

The expansion content is designed for lvl 85, so I'm guessing all the spells will be for lvl85.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Kanan on November 30, 2009, 09:16:09 PM
/chuckle.. I'm soooo dead on most raid mobs the first few weeks after I get this.

I hadn't thought about the MR chanter line coupled with this before.. /grin.. that one's gonna be worthwhile & fun again!  Time to polish off the hotkey again.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Khauruk on November 30, 2009, 09:51:06 PM
Indeed, we'll be an excellent target for single-cast MR.  At least Manaflare line causes almost no agro.  Well, we're a great target when we can spam DoTs already....but I digress.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Latang on December 01, 2009, 12:05:17 AM
Quote from: Khauruk on November 30, 2009, 09:51:06 PM
Indeed, we'll be an excellent target for single-cast MR.  At least Manaflare line causes almost no agro.  Well, we're a great target when we can spam DoTs already....but I digress.

Ashamed to ask, but what do you mean by "spamming DoTs"? I have a bit of a gap in my EQ knowledge from when I took a few years off...
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Khauruk on December 01, 2009, 12:13:12 AM
Every time you cast a DoT, Manaflare (and upgrades) will proc off of the initial damage on it.  So, if you know you have more than enough mana for an event, you can just cast a DoT every time you have nothing else to cast to get that manaflare proc.

It's not mana efficient, and it's not a huge dps boost, but the damage can add up nicely on a fight where you have no other ability to use mana.  Rank 3 of the aura version (if you're grouped w/ an enc) adds 1447 damage (w/ 10% chance of the damage being calculated multiples times) every 2.5 seconds when you re-apply that DoT.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Kanan on December 01, 2009, 04:13:03 PM
The dots have 0 cast time helps tremendously in their usage now too.

TBH, that's one of biggest reasons I'll use them on raids.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: sicshift on December 01, 2009, 08:41:35 PM
good gawd can a brotha get a real group haste spell? wtf is the deal? one of the most rediculous things ive seen.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Gutterr on December 01, 2009, 10:17:49 PM
Quote from: sicshift on December 01, 2009, 08:41:35 PM
good gawd can a brotha get a real group haste spell? wtf is the deal? one of the most rediculous things ive seen.

Hah, I got asked by a paly why I kept casting the fooking haste on him (was resummoning pets after a death on raids).  Unlinking them would be nice, as would a longer cast time.  Not a huge deal since buffs can be botted/begged/etc, but would be nice to have.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Hamtarro on December 01, 2009, 11:08:42 PM
So those of you who were in beta, what did you think about the future of our class? I'm already feeling a bit underpowered at the moment as-is, with average damage and very little utility in the raid game to make up for it, do you see our damage relative to the other classes staying about the same in UF?
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Blarp on December 01, 2009, 11:18:39 PM
well that depends. yes we kinda lack on dps, but if you time EVERything just right you should be close to top DPS in your guild atm with korsmual and OMM wep same PEr aug ratio i am pulling 7200+ DPS  depening on group setup. no glypg's.   i like to see our trip and dub atkk uped a good bit that would help our over all dps alot. if/when they fix our warder will make a BIG diff.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: AbyssalMage on December 02, 2009, 03:52:46 AM
Quote from: Hamtarro on December 01, 2009, 11:08:42 PM
So those of you who were in beta, what did you think about the future of our class? I'm already feeling a bit underpowered at the moment as-is, with average damage and very little utility in the raid game to make up for it, do you see our damage relative to the other classes staying about the same in UF?

We should see a signifigant DPS boost simply by weapon upgrades if you can obtain them, but every mellee is receiving this "boost" to better match the inflation of the DPS of Wiz/Necro in SoD.  As far as where we end up on the charts...Look to be where we are at now...Pure DPS, Hybrids, and then us.  With out them boosting pet DPS or our personal DPS we aren't going anywhere fast.

Actually the expansion may be a blessing in disguise as most groups will be Tank, Cleric, Chanter, Druid, DPS, Free slot.  We can fit in the free slot for the additional DPS and Slower to free up the chanty to do crowd control.  We're screwed if they give the Druid slot to a Shaman though as that allows a Wizzy, Beserker, Necro, Mage, Rogue, or Monk who all out DPS us.  Not to mention if they go super cautious and choose a Bard for the Free slot for pulling/cc or use a Pally Tank freeing up the Druid/Shaman slot, to provide more DPS with the above mentioned classes.

God, I really remember now why I hated GoD expansion so munch now, so little flexibility...
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Hzath on December 02, 2009, 05:36:42 AM
Quote from: Hamtarro on December 01, 2009, 11:08:42 PM
So those of you who were in beta, what did you think about the future of our class? I'm already feeling a bit underpowered at the moment as-is, with average damage and very little utility in the raid game to make up for it, do you see our damage relative to the other classes staying about the same in UF?

We'll see a nice boost when the expansion launches with our awesome new spell (yes, it's unlinked with everything) and new AAs.  There's a big IF tied to that, you need to either group with very good tanks or tank everything yourself.  Once melee start getting better weapons they'll probably make up more ground than we gained.  I see us staying about where we are when it's all said and done, maybe moving up slightly in DPS.  We didn't really get anything new utility related so I would say that's gonna be degraded.

People that like to tank are going to have a rough time of it.  Tier7 zones tore me apart with just 1 merc in tower gear and lots of AC.  I did some testing wearing appropriate level group gear and wow, that's scary stuff what those mobs were doing to me.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Hzath on December 02, 2009, 05:50:33 AM
Oh ya

Friendly pet - level 83
Frozen Venom - level 84
Haegren's Feralgia - level 85
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Catnip_Inny on December 02, 2009, 06:12:15 AM
yes the expansion is VERY non bst friendly id say... i like the challenging aspect of it but, most groups will need a real tank, healer, CC/puller or both... and then dps.... in SoF/SoD i tanked most groups even korafax ect but these mobs ripped me a new one with T5 group gear(SoD) and 2 T5 cleric mercs...

with the content being as hard as it is i think its going to be difficult for players to achieve the higher teired group weapons that have tehse good ratios... think the highest ones are 3.0 ratio... but i dont wanna see who u have to kill for those lol~!
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: bobokatt1970 on December 02, 2009, 04:46:30 PM
I think we really are missing the point that the EQ population is rather lacking on all if not most servers.  The days of no one wanting this class or that in favor of another is long gone IMO. 

In my guild, if you are on... and folks are actually doing something, they will take whoever they can get -- granted if you have a base of usual friends it helps.  In my opinion the BST still can fill in pretty much any spot (other than dedicated healer or tank of course -- and more so in this expansion obviously due to the insane mobs and their DPS and HP).  But I have not been without a job or place in years... anything this expansion will provide just makes us better.

Anyhow the only thing I can think of.... is that for once we are getting insane new content (difficulty of mobs I mean), and we ARE NOT getting a level boost.  We can all remember the first few weeks and months of a new expansion and hitting top tier zones and exclaiming how freaking hard it was to do, and then look back 1 year after and noting how much easier it became.  Without the 5 usual level increase I don't see that happening.  Maybe because of this we shall really see more differences between the survivability and effectiveness of some classes.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: wildwaters on December 02, 2009, 08:26:04 PM
Typically we get our coolest aa's and spells from non-level cap expansions.

Besides, if it is hard that is good. If we wanted the game dumbed down anymore we'd find a different mmo.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: AbyssalMage on December 02, 2009, 11:36:44 PM
Quote from: wildwaters on December 02, 2009, 08:26:04 PM
Typically we get our coolest aa's and spells from non-level cap expansions.

Besides, if it is hard that is good. If we wanted the game dumbed down anymore we'd find a different mmo.

They tried what they are doing now during GoD and there was no spot for a BST except the 6th slot or the Slower spot.  Underfoot from every Beta tester I've talked to personally or seen posted has basically described this expansion as GoD 2.0.  GoD was a horrible expansion for EVERYONE except the hard core raiding guilds and the seriouse gamer.  It literally was the expansion that "seperated the adults from the kids" and caused one of the greatest exodus's in EQ's history w/only the release of WoW being greater.  So if you liked GoD on release your going to like Underfoot ALOT, otherwise I see it taking "the 3rd spot of worst expansion" award w/only LoY and GoD beating it out for top 2 honors.  Also note it hasn't been released yet and even GoD was tuned down after release so the same things may happen with Underfoot.  Even GoD was more tollerable after the series of patches that came after launch making it easier to stomoche putting out $20-$40 for an expansion that basically gave everyone the Beserker class (and 2 zones and the instance Serwer zones to explore in) and nothing else for their money (Unless you where the hard core gamer/raider). 
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Khauruk on December 03, 2009, 03:01:50 AM
From what I've seen, GoD 2.0 is only partially right.

There is a clear upgrade path which works - T6 is harder than Korafax, but is doable with Korafax gear.

That said, it won't be doable in the way we've become accustomed - through mercenary tanks or only one merc cleric.  It also won't have the easy uncrowded open zones we're mostly accustomed to.  It probably won't have bst tanking much content.

And yeah...I would be surprised if it's not detuned a bit w/in a couple months.

Hopefully release state doesn't ensure it's the last expansion.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Kanan on December 03, 2009, 02:29:44 PM
One question I have atm: are the spells all going to be quested/dropped?

Or will they be vendored and such as for the "normal" spells we get?

Or is this up in the air until release?
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Grbage on December 03, 2009, 03:26:27 PM
Quote from: AbyssalMage on December 02, 2009, 11:36:44 PM
Quote from: wildwaters on December 02, 2009, 08:26:04 PM
Typically we get our coolest aa's and spells from non-level cap expansions.

Besides, if it is hard that is good. If we wanted the game dumbed down anymore we'd find a different mmo.

They tried what they are doing now during GoD and there was no spot for a BST except the 6th slot or the Slower spot.  Underfoot from every Beta tester I've talked to personally or seen posted has basically described this expansion as GoD 2.0.  GoD was a horrible expansion for EVERYONE except the hard core raiding guilds and the seriouse gamer.  It literally was the expansion that "seperated the adults from the kids" and caused one of the greatest exodus's in EQ's history w/only the release of WoW being greater.  So if you liked GoD on release your going to like Underfoot ALOT, otherwise I see it taking "the 3rd spot of worst expansion" award w/only LoY and GoD beating it out for top 2 honors.  Also note it hasn't been released yet and even GoD was tuned down after release so the same things may happen with Underfoot.  Even GoD was more tollerable after the series of patches that came after launch making it easier to stomoche putting out $20-$40 for an expansion that basically gave everyone the Beserker class (and 2 zones and the instance Serwer zones to explore in) and nothing else for their money (Unless you where the hard core gamer/raider). 

Actually I was mainly a grouper with some casual raids tossed in when GoD came out and I loved it. Couldn't take a hit but found it fun anyway.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Kanan on December 03, 2009, 06:28:50 PM
I remember the major problems I had getting into some of the groups or doing some of the sewer expeditions for the spells back when GoD was fairly new.  I honestly hope that's not gonna happen again =/
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Karve on December 04, 2009, 10:32:03 AM
I'm sure GoD was responsible for my first departure from EQ, fortunately thi stime around I am not entirely casual anymore ;~)
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Hzath on December 06, 2009, 04:30:49 PM
Quote from: Kanan on December 03, 2009, 02:29:44 PM
One question I have atm: are the spells all going to be quested/dropped?

Or will they be vendored and such as for the "normal" spells we get?

Or is this up in the air until release?

Rank 1 spells are from missions (Which combinations I have no idea)
Rank 2 are dropped (I never found any of ours, but I did see other classes)


I suppose I'll spill the beans about one of our spells getting changed.  Haergen's Feralgia is now an alternate Yowl at the Moon swarm pet that also procs Growl of the Jaguar on ourselves and warder.  The spell shares a recast timer with Yowl.  It's a pretty decent spell - you get a Yowl at the Moon and Growl of the Jag for less than their combined mana costs and also only one cast time.  The spell keeps the mob targetted while giving the growl buff, if your warder is dead the swarm pet still gets summoned but you won't get the growl buff.  If you have the Growl buff going Yowl will still be preferred swarm pet because it costs less mana.  Growl is basically obsolete now (if you even used it).
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: AbyssalMage on December 06, 2009, 09:23:54 PM
Quote from: bobokatt1970 on December 02, 2009, 04:46:30 PM
I think we really are missing the point that the EQ population is rather lacking on all if not most servers.  The days of no one wanting this class or that in favor of another is long gone IMO. 

The problem is...
Great your on...but you can't do the content 'cause you don't have a Tank/Cleric/Chanty(Bard) in your group.  Once you get those you now need to find a back up healer if you didn't get a Pally for a Tank and have to decide "can you survive w/out a Puller(if you don't have a bard/SK)?"  These were all problems when GoD was released and their was 2x as many players.  As you mentioned "the player base is constricted" so now you see where the problem lies.

Having a clear gear up path doesn't help you if the groups all have to be "cookie-cutter" ones.  GoD 1.0 you couldn't survive w/out Tank/Healer/CC/Puller/Sec. Healer/slower.  It was simply impossible to do w/out these "jobs" because you were guaranteed people were going to die.  I remember for a short time before the first revamp the Tank had to be a Warrior and even after the revamp you often did sewers w/2 tanks for off tanking adds and incase the tank got K.O.'d from the crazy proc's Noc's(correct NPC?) did before a heal could land.

I'm not saying Underfoot will be this bad (I sure hope not) but every post comments on the DPS the mobs are throwing out. their HP's, and finally mob density/roaming is going to make things very "challenging."  "Challenging" is good as long as the community can support such a challenge.  The question is if there are enouph of each "job" available to meet this "challenge."  GoD was a terrible expansion 'cause with 2x the community their wasn't enouph people to fill the jobs except at peak times and even then the missions weren't a guaranteed success.  Underfoot must succeed where GoD failed otherwise only bad things are to come.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Hzath on December 06, 2009, 09:47:31 PM
The main difference I see is that in current content there are more classes that can fulfill each of the roles as compared to GoD.  There are still just 3 tanks, but knights are very competent for group content (Rangers are real iffy w/o raid gear).  Druids/Shaman are much more viable as main healers in recent years, they might struggle some here but mercs are always an option as a secondary healer.  I've viewed pulling/cc as the same job for group content, an can be pulled by a multitude of skilled classes, monk/ranger/bard/enchanter/rogue/shadowknight all have tools that can get the job done. 

The hardest part of the expansion will be the initial jolt of actually having to use all the abilities each class is given.  It's not easy(in group gear) but everything I've seen is far from impossible.  Not every group named encounter will be a first(or third) time victory because of all their new tricks, and this may frustrate people, but the rewards will be worth it.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: wildwaters on December 08, 2009, 08:20:51 PM
Quote from: Hzath on December 06, 2009, 09:47:31 PM
The main difference I see is that in current content there are more classes that can fulfill each of the roles as compared to GoD.  There are still just 3 tanks, but knights are very competent for group content (Rangers are real iffy w/o raid gear).  Druids/Shaman are much more viable as main healers in recent years, they might struggle some here but mercs are always an option as a secondary healer.  I've viewed pulling/cc as the same job for group content, an can be pulled by a multitude of skilled classes, monk/ranger/bard/enchanter/rogue/shadowknight all have tools that can get the job done. 

The hardest part of the expansion will be the initial jolt of actually having to use all the abilities each class is given.  It's not easy(in group gear) but everything I've seen is far from impossible.  Not every group named encounter will be a first(or third) time victory because of all their new tricks, and this may frustrate people, but the rewards will be worth it.


This
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: nedoirah on December 12, 2009, 03:50:49 AM
I made a list of the AA costs. If anything is wrong please let me know so I can update my online list.
Divine companion aura 9 aa
Mnemonic retention 3/6/6/6 aa
Group perfected lev 7 aa
Spell casting mastery 3/6/9 aa
Spell casting subtly 3/3/3 aa
Gift of mana 6/?/?
Gift of radiant mana 9 aa
Gift of exquisite radiant mana 9 aa
Gift of amazingly exquisite radiant mana 9 aa
Companions blessing 7/8/9 aa
Hastened companions blessing 3/6/9 aa
Attack of the warders 7/7/7 aa
Force of animus 6/6/6 aa
Bite of the asp 6 aa
Gorilla smash 6 aa
Raven's claw 6 aa
Bestial frenzy 5/5/5 aa
Paragon of spirit 12/12/12 aa
Focused paragon of spirit 6/6/6 aa
Prolific minion 3/6/9 aa (on hold)
Protection of the warder 6/6/6 aa
Tactical mastery 5/5/5 aa
Twinproc 7/7/7 aa
Combat agility/stability 6/7/8/9/10 aa
General sturdiness 6/6/6/6/6 aa
Burst of power 8/8/8 aa
Companions durability 3/3/3 aa
Weapon affinity 5 aa
Fury of magic 8/10/12 aa
Destructive fury 9/9/9 aa
Feral swipe 7 aa
Natures salve 6/6/6
Mystical attuning 5/5 aa
Mental stamina 5/5/5/5/5 aa
Persistent casting 6/6/6 aa
Hastened mass group buff 6/9/12 aa
Sturdy companion 7/7/7 aa
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Nusa on December 12, 2009, 04:54:10 AM
There's missing stuff and wrong number of levels on a couple of them. Also 1st-level cost changes. This is all beta data, right? Easiest if you just look at the live data in-game, rather than me trying parse your totally unsorted list. I suggest maintaining the General/Arch/Class distinction and alpha sort on your next list.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: nedoirah on December 13, 2009, 01:17:34 AM
Yes it is. As far as the alpha of the list, I will sort it out when I place the info on my web link.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Razimir on December 13, 2009, 07:25:00 AM
Quote from: nedoirah on December 12, 2009, 03:50:49 AM
Destructive fury 9/9/9 aa

DF was 9/10/11 iirc.

-Raz
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: nedoirah on December 15, 2009, 07:17:19 PM
Thanks Raz
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Vidyne on December 15, 2009, 08:54:21 PM
Quote from: nedoirah on December 12, 2009, 03:50:49 AM
Group perfected lev 7 aa

[Tue Dec 15 15:53:30 2009] You have gained the ability "Group Perfected Levitation" at a cost of 12 ability points.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Nusa on December 16, 2009, 11:04:12 PM
I was just handed Trade-in Gem: Friendly Pet Rk. II by a guildie. I inquired, and he told me it dropped in Underquarry.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: nedoirah on December 18, 2009, 12:04:33 AM
Thanks Vidyne
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Sharrien on December 18, 2009, 02:15:40 PM
Mystical Shield - 9

Unless they changed it, Spell Casting Mastery was 6/3/12.  Reported as a bug but I don't know if anything changed yet.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Nusa on December 18, 2009, 05:06:24 PM
[Tue Dec 08 09:34:34 2009] You have improved Mnemonic Retention 3 at a cost of 6 ability points.
[Tue Dec 08 09:34:44 2009] You have improved Mnemonic Retention 4 at a cost of 6 ability points.
[Tue Dec 08 09:36:49 2009] You have gained the ability "Nature's Salve" at a cost of 6 ability points.
[Tue Dec 08 09:37:21 2009] You have improved Bite of the Asp 2 at a cost of 6 ability points.
[Tue Dec 08 09:37:53 2009] You have improved Burst of Power 5 at a cost of 8 ability points.
[Tue Dec 08 09:38:00 2009] You have improved Burst of Power 6 at a cost of 8 ability points.
[Tue Dec 08 13:13:17 2009] You have improved Weapon Affinity 7 at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Tue Dec 08 19:37:25 2009] You have improved Feral Swipe 5 at a cost of 7 ability points.
[Tue Dec 08 20:42:43 2009] You have improved Bestial Frenzy 11 at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Wed Dec 09 18:25:20 2009] You have improved Bestial Frenzy 12 at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Wed Dec 09 22:09:03 2009] You have improved Bestial Frenzy 13 at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Fri Dec 11 10:44:02 2009] You have gained the ability "Spell Casting Subtlety" at a cost of 3 ability points.
[Fri Dec 11 10:44:25 2009] You have improved Spell Casting Subtlety 2 at a cost of 3 ability points.
[Fri Dec 11 11:53:43 2009] You have improved Spell Casting Subtlety 3 at a cost of 3 ability points.
[Fri Dec 11 19:08:39 2009] You have gained the ability "Improved Natural Invisibility" at a cost of 6 ability points.
[Sat Dec 12 09:25:43 2009] You have improved Hastened Feral Attacks 4 at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Sat Dec 12 10:19:41 2009] You have improved Hastened Feral Attacks 5 at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Sat Dec 12 12:58:06 2009] You have improved Hastened Feral Attacks 6 at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Sat Dec 12 16:25:48 2009] You have gained the ability "Mystical Shield" at a cost of 9 ability points.
[Sun Dec 13 11:23:10 2009] You have gained the ability "Spell Casting Mastery" at a cost of 6 ability points.
[Sun Dec 13 16:48:47 2009] You have improved Spell Casting Mastery 2 at a cost of 3 ability points.
[Tue Dec 15 10:00:58 2009] You have improved Spell Casting Mastery 3 at a cost of 12 ability points.
[Tue Dec 15 13:09:27 2009] You have gained the ability "Tactical Mastery" at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Wed Dec 16 10:25:49 2009] You have improved Tactical Mastery 2 at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Wed Dec 16 10:25:52 2009] You have improved Tactical Mastery 3 at a cost of 5 ability points.
[Thu Dec 17 11:52:18 2009] You have gained the ability "Focus of Animus" at a cost of 6 ability points.
[Thu Dec 17 14:56:12 2009] You have improved Focus of Animus 2 at a cost of 6 ability points.

Been spending time in UF rather than trying to earn AA, or I'd have three times as much done.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: nedoirah on December 18, 2009, 06:18:46 PM
Yes I knew of the bug having been in beta and testing the aa and their costs. I adjusted my figures based on the current trend of those types of aa costs.

Thanks Nusa and Sharrien.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: bobokatt1970 on December 19, 2009, 02:39:39 AM
Thanks Nusa, very helpful.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: nedoirah on December 19, 2009, 09:42:21 PM
Sorry to say this everyone but due to a bad response from SoE, my future in the game is seriously in question. I won't be doing any further work on the listing until I decide if I will return to the game.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Khauruk on December 20, 2009, 01:43:23 AM
Quote from: nedoirah on December 19, 2009, 09:42:21 PM
Sorry to say this everyone but due to a bad response from SoE, my future in the game is seriously in question. I won't be doing any further work on the listing until I decide if I will return to the game.

Sorry to hear that :(

Can you email me what you have, and I'll find somewhere to post it?  email addy PMed to you.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Kanan on December 21, 2009, 02:26:55 PM
Quote from: nedoirah on December 19, 2009, 09:42:21 PM
Sorry to say this everyone but due to a bad response from SoE, my future in the game is seriously in question. I won't be doing any further work on the listing until I decide if I will return to the game.

If it's the first time on a petition, send it again.  I don't know how many times I've gotten the totally wrong response from my initial petitions.  It often takes a 2nd one to be able to someone who actually is able to read english & comprehend what is being requested.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: nedoirah on December 30, 2009, 12:47:56 AM
I did speak to SoE again and got some of my issue resolved however the rest is going to remain as is. I have come to an understanding for the rest and will regain what I lost soon enough on my own.

On that note, I am going to resume work on my excel worksheet of our AAs.
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Catnip_Inny on December 30, 2009, 08:15:55 AM
you got rolled back for the exp exploit? :)
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: nedoirah on December 30, 2009, 06:19:42 PM
Yes. :(
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: Catnip_Inny on December 31, 2009, 08:30:43 AM
guildy did too... she lost a whack of progression shed done and other stuff :( not sure if she got the other stuff back or not :(
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: bobokatt1970 on January 01, 2010, 04:32:33 PM
For the uninformed, what roll back was this and why?
Title: Re: NDA Lifted INFO
Post by: kharthai on January 01, 2010, 04:58:48 PM
The Hole and some other zones were giving way more exp than intended (from what I heard, multiple AA's worth per mob).  They rolled back those who went to grind there (well, probably some innocents too).