AC soft cap for bst?

[Razimir]

I've heard monks saying, that 1200 ac is some kind of soft cap for them. I'm wondering if bsts got the same cap? I kind of doubt that we have, since 1200 ac vs. 1600 ac feels like a rather big difference, just my gut feeling though and no parses to back that up.

-Raz

[Tastian]

Soft cap based on what you are killing.  Seen parses at the 2k+ range that still showed a nice change in damage.  Lots of bst hit ac caps around 1k-1200 though because it takes a lot of raiding to get over that for most.  Againist old world stuff that's plenty.  More still helps in spots though.

[Dummkopf]

Up to and including most of PoP the softcap seems to be around the 1200 mark, in GoD however its way higher. It is not fully tested yet and i think it will be hard to do so, however there are rumours that the GoD softcap is around 1700 AC. Hitting the softcap doesnt mean you wont get more out of a higher ac, just the results in reduced damage/ac will be much smaller.

[Dakat]

Take note that high agility will raise your AC as well.  So if you have neglected this stat, might want to invest some in it.  If regular buffed and your not reaching 200 agi I would work on it.

I have noticed a big difference in tanking ability due to the high agility I have.

For 2 reasons.  1st is high agility so I dodge hits more frequently. 2nd high agility gives me a boost in AC.

I'll try to do some calculations with / without ac buffs and removing gear that has agility built in.

[Kherryn]

Think Coprolith already did those AC tests with agility.  Considering you'd have to tank the same mob for a really long time for the agility difference not to be swallowed up in statistical error, it's not a huge concern for many.  (100 Agi increase pre-255 equals about 3% more misses?)

While I grab agility when I can, I don't do so at the expense of other stats like hp.

On another note, are you guys saying 1200 buffed?

[Coprolith]

Yeah, sorry Dakat, but that "big difference in tanking ability" exists only in your mind. Firstly agility does nothing for dodging, just the miss ratio. Secondly, going from 75AGI to 200AGI will net you a mere 4% increase in avoidance, AGI above 200 does even less, maybe another % going from 200 to 305. The benefit is so small it takes a samplesize of 100k swings just to parse it out. During normal gameplay the statistical variance in your avoidance completely obscures it.

The AC increase from AGI you see in your listed AC is virtually meaningless. The listed AC is a composite number, the sum of your avoidance AC and your mitigation AC. AGI adds only to the avoidance AC but the benefit you get from it is much less then the amount of mitigation AC. If 2 characters both have 1100AC, but one has 75 AGI and the other has 305 AGI, then the person with 75 AGI has the best tanking ability because his mitigation AC is higher.

/hugs

[Dakat]

Agility

This determines how often you get hit or missed by an attack and how much damage you take when you get hit.  It also affects how quickly you learn defensive skills.  Since you will take less damage and have a better chance of not having your spells disrupted if you have a higher amount of agility, this is useful for both fighters and magic users.  

off of kazams

This is often debatable between every class out there of its usefulness. I alone think it is recommended. My unbuffed agility is 203.

Things I seem to notice once above 200:  Hit less often. Hit for less overall. Increased Armor Class.  Swing faster w/o haste item/spell.  It may be me, but after 4+ years in game, I go with what I know and not what someone else feels.

[Grymlok]

Dakat, this subject was pounded into the ground a couple monts ago.  Trust what people have proven via parsing over what you feel.

[Coprolith]

Yah, its real easy to let the RNG fool you into believing whatever you want to believe in, 4+ years of EQ exp or no. Parsed data is the only objective measure of a stat.
I can't for the life of me understand why people are so zealous about the way they feel about agi. Its a melee stat so it must be important? It isnt.

Im not going to beat this dead horse again. Believe whatever you want to believe, but dont go about proclaiming how wonderful AGI is when there's hard data that says its not. Period.

Now let it die or this thread will end up in Rants again.

[Dumpty]

monks, our parent class are very anal post nerf and parse everything constantly in regards to their offensive and defensive abilities, so there is a lot of data out there on how functions of EQ work.

Yes, get agi "above 200", over the long run agi over 200 helps your avoidance "minorly" giving you a few percent more avoidance type defensive maneuvers.  once your 200+ in any stat unbuffed or self buffed i wouldnt worry about them very much as you reach a point of diminishing returns.


only thing anyone should really worry abour is getting to 305 sta, hp from sta is affected by some aa's and towards the top increases in raw hp arent major but are somehting physically you can see on your character and if for no other reason thereby worthwhile.   much of everything else as we see in this thread can still be the matter of speculation.

[Tastian]

"It may be me, but after 4+ years in game, I go with what I know and not what someone else feels."

"Things I seem to notice once above 200"

It's one thing to go with what you feel, but it crosses a line when you post here or in response to someone asking a question.  You are more than welcome to give your opinion and stuff, but the simple fact is you give wrong information quite a bit.  This has been parsed by a lot of people and simply put the changes are very minor.  You say you'll go with what you know, yet say yourself you "seem to notice".  The RNG, how our brain works and many other factors make in game observations very sketchy.  Somethings are obvious and you can have a "feel" for them.  That "feel" can then be backed up through tests and parsing and data.  In this case the parsing and data has consistantly shown very minor results.  As always play your char how you want and do what you want.  However, everytime you post "get agi up" I guarantee you that atleast a couple people will be right behind you pointing out that it's really minor hehe.

[Celi]

http://p201.ezboard.com/fmonklybusiness43508frm2.showMessage?topicID=1259.topic

Monk AC soft cap against Valorian Guard in Halls of Honor is around 1300. Detailed parse in that post with every class.

[Dakat]

I don't think the mitigation numbers I provided give an accurate picture in the VERY large differences in mitigation across the classes.

Quote from the very guy who made the Parce.

Also, you can't compare a parce of a monk with a beast.  Monks were overpowering a while back and were nerfed quite a bit.

[Coprolith]

Also, you can't compare a parce of a monk with a beast. Monks were overpowering a while back and were nerfed quite a bit.

Yes, you can. That parse pretty much shows that all 3 leather classes mitigate the same way. Monks used to be on a higher mitigation table, now they share the same mitigation table as the other two leather classes. Same goes for the chain classes. PAL, SK, BRD and CLR are also on the same mitigation table, WAR gets a bonus.
What little differences exist in mitigation between the classes in a particular armortype group can be ascribed to differences in defense skill cap.

- Mitigation is determined almost entirely by worn AC, with defense skill giving small differences between the classes.
- Avoidance is determined almost exclusively by the defensive skills (including d/p/r/b), with AGI having a marginal effect.

/hugs

[Dakat]

Its obvious your trying to beat a dead horse with a stick here.  I don't recognise that guy as a source of Everquest. If Sony says so, then I'll beleave it.  

You can impress me with numbers all you want, it still will not convince me.