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Quick little update (7/9/04)...

Started by Tastian, July 07, 2004, 07:17:21 AM

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Chackra

Tastian may have a more direct line on these things, but the responses to the suggestions are, to put it bluntly, either "yes", "no", or "maybe."  

I was hoping for a bit more feedback than that.  Such as "we may have problems coding that change," or "we believe that would impact beastlord power relative to other classes," then we would have an idea whether to suggest alternatives, or maybe just shut up about certain types of requests and focus on others.

Ukator Iceblood

Opening up at least one of the other weapon skills to 250 would rock. One other option be it 1hb, 2hb, or piercing.
Ukator Iceblood and Wolf
70 Beastlord

Kator Kerrath
Berserker

Tunare's Benevolence
Xegony

Tastian

Some of the responses weren't very specific, but I have a decent idea on each.  Like I said I'll put up an updated top 10 list tomorrow evening or so with a few other ideas for people to offer feedback on.

kukana

Aggro control seems to be a repeated theme across several threads.  I think everyone agrees we have more than enough ways to actaually CREATE agro.  IMHO, the simplest solution would be a discipline to reduce agro similiar to evade.  Then, if you need it you got it, if you need to reduce it, there ya go.

Trying to look at this as addressing aggro on specific spells or AA effects dances around the overall issue of aggro control.

just my 2cp.
Kukana
Feral Lady
Tunare <Shadow of the Dragon>
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Magelo Profile

Tastian

"Trying to look at this as addressing aggro on specific spells or AA effects dances around the overall issue of aggro control. "

The thing is some of beastlord aggro generation is directly tied to aggro issues on certain spells.  Poison dots do tons of aggro per damage compared to a nuke for instance.  That isn't a beastlord problem, but an issue that effects shaman and necros and other dot classes.  

Also you have to put things in perspective.  Beastlords main aggro problem is from doing damage.  It's simply a case of a beastlord doing 50+ less damage than another class and still getting smeared on tank changes.  If you make a change to allow evade then you will see beastlords getting less aggro well say slowing or something.  However, slowing should be the issue.  To me this is very similiar to how some want a malo(ish) spell to help our slows land.  I do aggro in spots our slows just bounce too much, however, adding a malo(ish) spell effects debuffs for our nukes, it effects other casters in the group, etc.  Where as just adding a -mod to our slow only effects us trying to land slow.  The main issue is making sure that the change effects what it needs to well having as little effect on everything else as possible.

Bengali

Quote[Tue Jul 13 23:14:11 2004] Aramelus tells the raid,  'Assist ~ ► Defender of Righteousness ◄ ! ☺ ☻ASSIST'
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:17 2004] You punch Defender of Righteousness for 142 points of damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:18 2004] You punch Defender of Righteousness for 106 points of damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:19 2004] Bengali hit Defender of Righteousness for 750 points of non-melee damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:19 2004] Defender of Righteousness's body is torn in a time lapse.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:19 2004] You crush Defender of Righteousness for 83 points of damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:19 2004] Bengali hit Defender of Righteousness for 150 points of non-melee damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:19 2004] Defender of Righteousness is covered in a thin layer of ice.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:20 2004] You crush Defender of Righteousness for 45 points of damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:20 2004] Bengali hit Defender of Righteousness for 150 points of non-melee damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:20 2004] Defender of Righteousness is covered in a thin layer of ice.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:21 2004] You punch Defender of Righteousness for 130 points of damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:22 2004] You crush Defender of Righteousness for 79 points of damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:22 2004] Defender of Righteousness goes on a RAMPAGE!
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:24 2004] You begin casting Turepta Blood.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:24 2004] Defender of Righteousness goes on a RAMPAGE!
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:24 2004] Janson goes into a berserker frenzy!
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:26 2004] Bengali hit Defender of Righteousness for 121 points of non-melee damage.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:26 2004] Defender of Righteousness's veins begin to burn.
[Tue Jul 13 23:14:26 2004] Defender of Righteousness says 'You will not evade me Bengali!'

I took out some guild stuff and random spam, including pet messages, but  I left in all the damage that I did and I didn't take out any other summoning messages.

In other words, I was the *only* one to get summoned (summoned over the low health warrior, to boot) even though we had wizards and mages and rogues and monks there and I can guarantee you that they had done more damage than I did at that point.   Even my two debuff procs shouldn't have made a difference over the SK/druid/shaman debuffs.   You can't tell from these parses but it's not like I cast the dot while the mob was at 95% either.   It was probably at 60-70% or less.
Savagespirit Bengali Grimmspirit, Scion of Shar Vahl

"My friend Mark said that he saw Bengali totally uppercut some kid just because the kid opened a window.
And that's what I call REAL Ultimate Power!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Tastian

Yup, that's a VERY common situation.  I honestly can't help but wonder if you actually had the DoT loaded just to test the aggro or not hehe.  I know for a fact that I can't use poison dots remotely efficenctly unless I'm MT'n or solo'n.  *shrugs*  Also not to derail this thread, but I'm going to be posting the revised top 10 list to start getting some feedback on it.  Please look it over as you can and offer your suggestions.  I'm going to turn the list back in next friday, but before then I'd to poll people on an issue or two that has several possible solutions and see which most like best.

kukana

Last night, I was with a group in Vxxd.  The DPSers were myself, a warrior, and a wizard.  Pet had Spirit of Flame running with Taunt turned off.  The rest of the group was an enchanter, shaman, and cleric.

Shaman would pull with slow and warrior would immediately take agro.  My pet would attack and I would join the frey at 95%.  Without even hitting the attack button, the mob would turn to hit me.

I then switched to a 2HB with a poor damage/delay ration.  Same effect.

I didn't even DoT or nuke or anything.

I'm guessing I forgot to shower the way I was pulling agro.
Kukana
Feral Lady
Tunare <Shadow of the Dragon>
--
Magelo Profile

Nakab

I know this has been mentioned before, but an easy answer would be to just give us a spell like the Ranger's spell, jolt. That way we can cast as needed and not rely on using it with a timer tied to it, e.g. Feral Swipe.

Just as a side note, wouldn't it be nice to hover the mouse over pet buffs and know when they will expire? Love how that works for normal buffs :-)

kukana

I guess the question is where is your space more limited?  Spell slots or action slots?  I know my spells are already full without having to put in another one, plus casting takes time away from doing DPS, where a discipline or AA would be basicly instant-use.
Kukana
Feral Lady
Tunare <Shadow of the Dragon>
--
Magelo Profile

rhorse

This may be a silly question. But with all the new zones, new spells and such. Why couldn't they give us another 2 spell slots?

Jkal_Shihar

QuoteThis may be a silly question. But with all the new zones, new spells and such. Why couldn't they give us another 2 spell slots?

Be nice though, I remember reading a while back ago, before Brenlo took charge and Absor was still running the show. He gave the explanation that to add more spell slots wouldve required alot of work on the coding. And also it makes players choose there spells carefully.
But with all these changes and such where they said they couldnt do certain things cause of coding and now found other ways to implement things. I dont see why they still cant add even 1 spell slot at least.
Well heres to wishful thinking at least.
Animist Jkal Shi`har and tigger
Arch Animist of the Tribunal Server
My Magelo
*still my main since dec. 2001*

Rhaynne

QuoteThis may be a silly question. But with all the new zones, new spells and such. Why couldn't they give us another 2 spell slots?

I'd rather have another 2 buff slots.

Choppin

2 extra spellslots (maybe I can mem a pet heal then and eventually shrink + anull magic at same time heh)

and an extra 10 buff slots (remember they are used as debuff slots too)

that would be helpful
Choppin Lethal
Feral Lord