Leveling help or AA versus Levels debate...

[Tastian]

"If you're wanting to get 65 and lots of AA's with the least time spent. Level to 65 the fastest way you can, then farm AA's in PoE or PoFire. "

Shouldn't that be, level to 65 the fastest way you can, GET FLAGGED, then farm AA's in PoE or PoFire?  I mighta just missed being handed elemental access upon dinging 65, but I'm pretty sure I spent months after PoP first came out trying to get into those blasted things lol.  The real good advice is right here though...

"go about it your own way."

Amen.  8)  To each their own...

[ghostryder]

I guess if you want to go stir crazy and tire of the game quickly this guide is okay, but I dare say I know no one who 'farms AAs' in the Plains day after day and night after night, in fact most 65's don't farm anything aside from loot to buy their spells, and most of those farm spots offer terrible AA XP for the level 65 player.

AAs, without a doubt, during a month period of normal play, when no 'AA farming' takes place comes quickest at level 60 - in fact 100 aa per month with an average 3 hr log time doing everyday player activities like farming plat or grouping is about average without even thinking about AAs.

I have several 65 toons on some have zoomed to 65 and some have stopped at 60, and without question when looking at overall AAs in terms of months the level 65 toons average 35-50 AAs per month while my 60 toons who have stopped (usually for 2 monthes on average) earned 100- 120 AAs per month.

In fact, I've never met a level 65 that ever did much better than 40-50, even throwing in his 'AA farming' which has a very short life span for anyone that does it- and it gets worse for those that raid a lot.

While at 60, and earning plat, your enjoy the fastest blue con kills in most farm locations, like for example AC, farming masks and swords and tunics for bazaar sales earns 3-4 AA nightly, whereas a 65 there earns hardly none, and if they venture into the castle where the mobs con blue it takes them 3 times as long to kill a single mob because of the enormously greater hitpoints on those mobs.

At 60, almost everywhere you go outside of raiding will garner simular results- whereas the level 65 is restricted to 'special situations' to intact good AAs, and dispite the forcoming claims those 'special situations' are more rare than common- no one, and I mean no one, 'farms AAs' for any length of time before quickly tiring of it- in reality other things always takes president- getting a full spell book, getting flagged, raiding- ect and at the end of the month those few times of AA farming don't stack up to what the level has managed.

I've proved this time and again with guildmates when playing alts, and when we both hit 60 I'd bet them where we'd both be in 6 months. He zoomed to 65 and I stayed 60 for 3 months- I had 312 AAs when I dinged 65, and he hadn't hit a 100. He had gotten side tracked farming for plat for spells, and raiding for equipment. I, on the other hand had my AAs come in when I farmed for that same plat at 60, and had a full spell book when I dinged- and was not forced to farm light blue cons for plat because I no longer had a need for it.

My time from then on was a mixture of LDON and raiding, and at the end of that 6 months I was running over 400 AAs and my partnered had yet to even hit 150.


So before anyone makes contrary claims, go back and figure out when you dinged 65, count the months and do the math- and dispite all the claims of "I can get 8AAs in PoT in a night" see exactly what you actually averaged, and chances are very good you too are in the 25-40AA per month range.

[Banga]

The only math I need is an AA every 30-45 min.    Show me a place at level 60 where that can be done.    That is my reason to never recommend going AA before 65.

HoH can be an AA every 45-60 Minutes, at level 65, and does not require EP.

[ghostryder]

AC compares to that especially once they start stacking up and your damage increases and your downtime disappears - I was achieving that easy.

like i said- do the math- your not doing 100AA a month at 65- no 65 does- and to prove it to yourself when did you ding 65 and how many AAs do you have- search past posts if your confused on the date- almost everyone proclaims when they ding 65 on the boards-

[Dasquid]

When I was looking for groups, I always tried to be the lowest in the group and tried to move to the next zone when I was at the lower level range required.

Haha, sounds like all the people I meet in places I solo, who are lower level than my pet and spam me for groups. I'd say 95% of the time they are just exp sponges who loot corpses before they hit the ground.

[ghostryder]

I meet those types quite often myself rofl- can't blame the poor saps, leveling in eq is painfully slow compared to most other online games- which is why I challenge the above advice-

It is always more efficient to kill as many birds as possible with one stone than just only one bird, which is why doing your AAs while you farm plat or group or quest is quicker than zooming to 65, having to AA grind and not get anything else done- and when you do go to do thoses other needed things have your AAs crawl.

At 60 AAs fly by as you farm for need upgrades, weapons and spells, thus it is far more efficient. At 65 you may find fast AAs in certain zones, but not much else- and like it or not those other things will need to be done-
and at the end of 6 months, or a year, or whatever extended time frame you want to look at- the guy who stopped and did all those things at one time will be sitting in a much better position than the guy who zoomed to 65 and had to kill only one bird at a time.

[neight]

Not that I agree with the thread author, but ...

like i said- do the math- your not doing 100AA a month at 65- no 65 does-

100AA a month at 65 isn't hard at all. Hell I could pull that soloing in Droga, let alone grouping in Earth / Fire ...

Neight

[Tardar]

8aa a day in Earth is /shrug, so 100 a month if you have the time would be /shrugx2

[ghostryder]

Sure, but neither zone offers much else does it? Who really wants to set and grind AAs in some god aweful zone with crap loot and drops? Who wants to grind AAs at all? Not many sane people.

And that's the point- the zoom to 65s assume its a cake walk to 'grind AAs' when in reality it's torture. You've got a lot of other stuff going on other than AAs, many of it far more important-

Someone, who for example, is in a raiding guild will want the levels so he can raid- but with a full compliment of nightly raid buffs the only real AAs he's gonna worry about is paragon, and once he gets those he's off getting much needed raid drops-

It's not totally honest, nor practical, to tell someone to zoom to 65 to get fast AAs when the majority of people simply don't play like that at the high end.-

Staying at 60, and getting several things done and having the AAs roll in without haveing to 'grind AAs' in some lame loot spot in PoP and having the AA worries taken care of in 2 or 3 months leaves the 65 player open to do the more important things that he wants to do once he reaches that platue.

Plus, if AAs grinding is something that he wants to do, there's nothing stopping him from going into PoP at 60 either. But its so nice to have your plat worries over, you bazaar purches over and having a full spell book when you finally ding 65, and that can all be done in couple months at 60.

The number of people who manage to accomplish that in that short of time after zooming to 65 is rare- so rare I've yet met a single one in 5 years of play.

And I've already looked at all your profiles, you not one either:)

[Hrann]

I've seen this argument from you before ghostryder, and I've been looking out, and all I can say is that you appear to be dead on.

From the standpoint of character power in time, the case can still be made to get to 65 as quick as possible, because the things done after reaching 65 may be just as important (or moreso) than getting AAs (such as raiding for equipment etc).

But from a pure AA # point of view, level 65s just don't seem to gain them that fast.  I know people who do those 8-10 AA nights/days, but they do it once and then you don't hear about it again for a month and a half or so.  Very few people continue to grind day in and day out after they've reached level 65.

It appears to be a simple case of the tortoise and hare.  The level 60-62 is getting an AA or 2 each day, but the 65 gets a whole bunch and then goes and does other stuff.  There's lots to do at 65 besides AAing, and it shows.

It's sorta interesting to watch IMO.  My guild board has a roster which shows everyone's AAs and I can see it there.

[Oneiromancer]

It seems to me that this is a flawed argument.  You're saying that a 60 beastlord who focuses on AAs gets more AAs than a 65 beastlord who doesn't focus on AAs.  Well, duh.  Of course they are different.  Just because a 65 can have other things on their table doesn't mean that if they went into a pure AA mode that they'd make less.  When you run an experiment you can't change half the factors and draw useful conclusions; you have to vary things only slightly.  In this case, the only variable should be level.

So comparing the 60 and 65 beastlord, the 65 has a superior slow, haste pet, pet proc, buffs, etc.  They have access to all the double-attack AAs, as well as some others vital ones (such as LR).  The only real benefits I see the 60 beastlord having is that their dblue limit is 5 levels lower, and they will get an exp bonus for mobs above 55 (whereas the 65 only gets the bonus for mobs 60 and above).  Based on those criteria, I think the 65 still has the ability to farm AAs faster, all other things being equal.

Game on,

[neight]

Sure, but neither zone offers much else does it? Who really wants to set and grind AAs in some god aweful zone with crap loot and drops? Who wants to grind AAs at all? Not many sane people.

I do it all the time. I'll join a guild group in Earth or Fire any time (nooo pickup groups). You make it sound as if once you ding 65, there's no fun left in the game. It all becomes a grind. Guess what; it's pretty much the same thing you did at 60, but this time you have the inherent bonuses that come from being a higher level character. What zones are not "god aweful [sic]" with spectacular loot and drops that you're grinding AAs in at 60?

If you think there's nothing left to do at 65 besides "grinding" AAs in some slum of Norrath, I'm really not sure why you're still playing. Raiding, grouping with friends/guildies, and soloing are all fun (for me anyway), and are done at 65 the same way they're done at 60.

Someone, who for example, is in a raiding guild will want the levels so he can raid- but with a full compliment of nightly raid buffs the only real AAs he's gonna worry about is paragon, and once he gets those he's off getting much needed raid drops-

Yeah, that's one hell of a Beastlord. Who needs AAs besides Paragon? They're worthless on raids! MGB, /pet hold, LR5/ID5/ND3, SCR3, Mend Companion+HM, Suspend Minion2, PA/pet crits/flurries, Ambi, SS, BF5 ... yeah, all pointless.

It's not totally honest, nor practical, to tell someone to zoom to 65 to get fast AAs when the majority of people simply don't play like that at the high end.-

They don't? There's always groups running in Earth/Fire, and for the non-elemental crowd, (god help me) BoT and PoV always have a good number of 65s in them. What is "totally honest" and "practical" is to tell people to play the game however the hell they want. I stopped and did a number of AAs at 54 and 62, and regret doing it, as I pull in AAs much faster now than I ever have. That said, I certainly don't hold anything against people who do want to work AAs early. I wouldn't call presenting some doomsday view of the 65 game "honest" either.

Neight

[ghostryder]

It seems to me that this is a flawed argument. You're saying that a 60 beastlord who focuses on AAs gets more AAs than a 65 beastlord who doesn't focus on AAs.

No, Im saying at 60 there's no need to focus on AAs, they come natyrally as you focus on other things yuou need to get done- but if you wait til 65 you almost have to focus on AA grinding because they crawl for what most 65s are doing- and the focusing on the AAs is what you what to avoid.

Take 2 characters and one goes to 65 and one stays 60- each needs plat for spells- the one who farms that plat at 60 will get AAs will they do it, whereas the one at 65, now needing the same spells- must farm plat too- and you know what- they farm at the same exact camps and it takes them just as long but the 60 toon is getting 3 AA a night and the 65 toon is lucky to get a single blue bubble because the mobs con light blue-

both are at that camp a month or two- depending on the amount of plat needed, but the 60 has his plat plus AAs, and the 65 only has his plat-

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
From the standpoint of character power in time, the case can still be made to get to 65 as quick as possible, because the things done after reaching 65 may be just as important (or moreso) than getting AAs (such as raiding for equipment etc).

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I agree with this. If your interested in pure power getting to 65 and in a raid position, then its the quickest way to power, no doubt about it, but if someone wants to get a full AA bank he better do it at 60 - at least for a couple months- or it probably won't happen because of other intersts, which is my main point-

My guild keeps AA track too, has upwards of 175 65 toons and that's pretty much where one can look at a glance to see the 25-40 AA average per month -

So although the claim looks good, and is basically correct on paper- in practice AAs at 65 poor in about the same rate they would for a 55 player on an average- 60 is the sweet spot- its the only level I've ever been able to walk away with 300 AA in the bank in 3 months without even thinking about it- though regrettably my main bought into the zoom theory and is still AA poor because of it- but not my alts- I never zoom up with them.

Of course this doesn't mean zooming to 65 is bad- there's a lot of other good reasons to decide to do it- but for AA intake staying 60 is always better.





[/quote]

[Shere Khaan]

Oneiromancer is dead on, the argument is flawed.

You are right that most 65's will not gain xp as fast as all that. The point is though they can get them faster. One Saturday I put 8 hours into Plane of Fire and came away with 17 aa's for my effort. The rest of the week I spent raiding and got some great loot from Plane of Time... which you can't get at 60. No "if"s of "but"s about it.

Being able to get aa's faster simply means that if you choose to focus on them, you can get aa's fasterthan you can at 60. I would also argue that Plane of Earth drops are not crap too. I'm sure a lot of Beastlords would like the PoE leather armour and or the Steel ring of earthern resilience. At the very least the drops sell for quite a lot and you can buy whatever you want from the bazaar.

What it comes down to is play style. If you want to be the best for your stage of the game then by all means stop and aa. But make no mistake, it is neither faster nor more effecient doing aa's at 60 than doing aa's at 65. It all comes down to what you enjoy more.

[Dummkopf]

No, Im saying at 60 there's no need to focus on AAs, they come natyrally as you focus on other things yuou need to get done- but if you wait til 65 you almost have to focus on AA grinding because they crawl for what most 65s are doing- and the focusing on the AAs is what you what to avoid.

I stopped actively grinding xp about half a year ago, that was with about 300 aas. Now i have 590 and just got the additional 290 aas by doing what i wanted to do without thinking about xp at all. So, aas come very naturally to me too, even raiding yields around 5-8 aas a week, having fun in some zones like kt or ikk one group trials yields even more, helping guildies getting kt flags is awsome xp as well. Nearly everything i do to have fun in this game (and believe me, i dont need to focus on plat) yields xp, so zooming to 65 and then just enjoying your life with all the additional power you get at 65 is just the most relaxed and easiest way to get aas and have fun in this game.

Focusing on aas was not as bad as it might sound, i got most of my points up to 300 having fun in poe or fire farming tradeskill stuff which in turn yielded several hundred k in plats.