Ok so I just read the WoW manual ...

[Ogee]

"Removed the imbedded picture. Please refrain from further links of this kind - Jaeren"

This is the part where i start crying that my 1st Amendment rights are being violated . Oh ya thats right i don't give a shit cause it was all in fun . Sorry a photo of an ass offends you . You must have a hell of a time with a mirror  :lol:

Just joking lighten up everyone  :wink:

[Jaeren]

We've gone over the images thing time and time again, please do not start it again.

[Ogee]

Just joking lighten up everyone  :wink:

Keep reading this until it makes sence .

[Khayden]

I also wouldn't doubt they're gonna be nowhere near as good as SOE at keeping it running and entertaining over a period of time.

I haven't tried WoW but what I hear from people who have it "great until you complete it". Seems to be born out by reports of level 20 players on release day.

Tell that to the guilds at the end of GoD when they have to kill the last boss only to watch it raise itself from the dead and make them go through it all again.

Plus "all the people you hear from" haven't seen anything of the "end" of WoW. During beta there was no "end". Oxynia (sp?) was as good as it got and the lowest anyone ever got her was 60ish%. What the hell was fun about EQ's end game? Not one damn thing that I saw that Blizzard couldn't do better.

If something wasn't fun any more after a while I'd stop doing it.  I assume the same of other people although tolerance thresholds are different of course.

EQ has been around a long time, surely someone is having some fun out there?  The end game in EQ has kept people busy for a long time, and sure opinions differ, but the fact is there are guilds who still raid the endgame content from many expansions and still enjoy it.  Does the fact that Tac'vi was a badly designed zone entirely negate all the other fun things in that expansion or any of the others?

As for WoW I freely admit I haven't played it and none of the people I have spoken to have played it to the "end", however the two comments I hear time and time again are that it's too easy to level and gets boring, and that the proportion of battlenet kiddies is vastly higher.

While EQ2 isn't free of problems the issues it has seem to be less serious to me; In the core game systems and the approach they've taken they seem to have learned the biggest lessons from EQ.

Every company that makes MMO games has it's fans and critics and goes through the same set of problems to varying degrees.  You have to remember that SoEs critics are gonna outnumber any other because their games have had the highest subscriber numbers for a long time.  Very few people shout nice things loud, lots more shout about bad things.

Personally the one I think will blow them both out of the water is Vanguard, the names on the team there have some huge and varied experience and I like the approach they describe.

Khayden

[Skanda]

If something wasn't fun any more after a while I'd stop doing it.  I assume the same of other people although tolerance thresholds are different of course.

EQ has been around a long time, surely someone is having some fun out there?  The end game in EQ has kept people busy for a long time, and sure opinions differ, but the fact is there are guilds who still raid the endgame content from many expansions and still enjoy it.  Does the fact that Tac'vi was a badly designed zone entirely negate all the other fun things in that expansion or any of the others?

Judging by the large amounts of people leaving EQ for either WoW or EQ2 I'd say there are some problems with EQ. There are several reasons a lot of people stick with EQ that have little to do with fun. They may not want to lose their friends or maybe all the work they put in their character just to start over in another game or they are refusing to quit till they see the "end game" in EQ not realizing that with each expansion that "end game" just keeps moving away.

I know quite a few people in my old EQ guild who fall under those three catagories.

As for WoW I freely admit I haven't played it and none of the people I have spoken to have played it to the "end", however the two comments I hear time and time again are that it's too easy to level and gets boring, and that the proportion of battlenet kiddies is vastly higher.

First, leveling does start to slow down around lvl 25. It's still faster then EQ or EQ2 but who made up the rule that leveling slow = fun? As long as Blizzard can supply enough lvl 60 content to keep people occupied then why should it take a long time to level?

You have to remember that SoEs critics are gonna outnumber any other because their games have had the highest subscriber numbers for a long time.  

Actually FFXI beats SoE for subscribers and in a month or three Blizzard more then likely will too if they keep this growth trend up.

[Latang]

This is the part where i start crying that my 1st Amendment rights are being violated . Oh ya thats right i don't give a shit cause it was all in fun . Sorry a photo of an ass offends you . You must have a hell of a time with a mirror  

Constitutes nudity, idiot. Want that stuff? Go visit porn sites. Want to show it to people? Put it in a link and describe it as "not work safe", the commonly accepted description for that crap. Looking at a naked guy's ass is not something I do out of choice, so shove your "fun" where it fits.

[Ogee]

Jeez now i feel shame Latang . I didn't know that a photo of a guys ass would stir your inner homo-erotic feelings and make you become all defensive .

[Merescata]

Gotta say here that "Not work safe" is the thing.  Folks have been fired for that sort of thing and getting fired is NOT funny.   :cry:

[Khayden]

You have to remember that SoEs critics are gonna outnumber any other because their games have had the highest subscriber numbers for a long time.  

Actually FFXI beats SoE for subscribers and in a month or three Blizzard more then likely will too if they keep this growth trend up.

EQ was number one from q3 99 to q3 03.  When FFXI beat it, SWG already had over a quarter of a million subscribers.  

WoW has gained a huge number of subscribers very quickly, so has EQ2.  If you look at the number of servers and the nightly population on them I'd guess that they're pretty similar in number.  I know WoW doubled the number of servers, but then so did EQ2 and they're still offering movelogs on the heavily loaded ones.

Khayden

[Skanda]

World of Warcraft;
Amazon.com Sales Rank in Computer & Video Games: #4
CE edition;
Amazon.com Sales Rank in Computer & Video Games: #658

Everquest 2;
Amazon.com Sales Rank in Computer & Video Games: #415
CE edition;
Amazon.com Sales Rank in Computer & Video Games: #1,585

True that's only 1 "store" out of dozens of major retailers but somehow I don't see EQ2 being able to keep up with World of Warcraft.

The only way I could see EQ2 having about as many players right now is if you could the people from Europe and Asia playing it. WoW hasn't released in either of those area yet so it's sitting on another massive boost to it's subscriptions until Blizzard releases in each of those respective countries.

i.e. There is no way on earth EQ2 will match WoW once WoW has gone worldwide.

[Incite]

GUYS!!!!  C'mon ... this is not about the games ... it's about SoE's crappy lore "writers".  Actually, scratch that I don't care what you rant about.

Ogee, it's nice to know you care!  But Bernard Manning > All, sorry.

Personally I *hated* EQ2, but I have friends who are enjoying it, so more power to them.  I am now playing WoW and very happy with it; a MMOG that is fun and not grind.  I will still play EQ1 because I am dedicated to my guild and enjoying raiding time, but damn, WoW is nice, even down to the boobies on the dorf women.

[Ogee]

I agree with ya there Incite "  I *hated* EQ2 " . I tried it a few times and it had no attraction for me . IMO it was just Eq for Dummies .

[Skanda]

GUYS!!!!  C'mon ... this is not about the games ... it's about SoE's crappy lore "writers".  Actually, scratch that I don't care what you rant about.

Sorry to derail your rant.  :P

I just couldn't let the

I also wouldn't doubt they're gonna be nowhere near as good as SOE at keeping it running and entertaining over a period of time.

comment pass.

And yes. I have a cat that could write better lore then SoE does.

[Incite]

I just couldn't let the

I also wouldn't doubt they're gonna be nowhere near as good as SOE at keeping it running and entertaining over a period of time.

comment pass.

And yes. I have a cat that could write better lore then SoE does.

Hehe, fair enough.  I am sure Blizzard will do well with expansions and added content as well.  I would think they will have to add something like AA because that was a big draw with EQ, being able to continue advancing your character when you maxed out level.  Hopefully something like that will be in hero classes.  Blizzard have an extremely long and successful track record in managing servers (Battle.net) and although they have made some mistakes they've been generally pretty good.

[Khayden]

World of Warcraft;
Amazon.com Sales Rank in Computer & Video Games: #4
CE edition;
Amazon.com Sales Rank in Computer & Video Games: #658

Everquest 2;
Amazon.com Sales Rank in Computer & Video Games: #415
CE edition;
Amazon.com Sales Rank in Computer & Video Games: #1,585

True that's only 1 "store" out of dozens of major retailers but somehow I don't see EQ2 being able to keep up with World of Warcraft.

The only way I could see EQ2 having about as many players right now is if you could the people from Europe and Asia playing it. WoW hasn't released in either of those area yet so it's sitting on another massive boost to it's subscriptions until Blizzard releases in each of those respective countries.

i.e. There is no way on earth EQ2 will match WoW once WoW has gone worldwide.

Wow, talk about meaningless comparisons.  Amazon ships what proportion of total game sales?  And lets see what WoWs rank is a month after release when everyone whos been waiting on it has bought it, especially if there's a game that ships a few hundred thousand copies released then.

For the record I agree the lore in EQ sucks balls, sorry for derailing but I'm an argumentative SoB when I think people are being closed minded.

Anyways have fun whatever you do!

Khayden