Good example of the ignorance of SoE and their own game.

[Latang]

Here we go:

http://lucy.allakhazam.com/item.html?id=47319

Great! It's a bst only weapon!

Oh wait, it's out-damaged by the RS h2h, the MPG h2h, the RS 1hb....

My god. See, we do a fuckton less damage than monks guys. Just so you know, making a bst only weapon with a WORSE ratio than the other weapons available to beastlords is fucking STUPID.

For the love of god, listen to Tastian, and pull your collective head outa ur ass.

[Latang]

Yes, I know it has a 300 dmg proc, and that isn't a bad thing, but to make the end-zone beastlord weapon something that is no better than something you can get from Riftseekers is just.... grrr...

Yes, the dps issue is starting to get me fairly angry.

[Tastian]

Everyone keeps linking me the mace and telling me how great it is.  lol MH the thing is ~10dps above an ED.  Not to mention it's another beastlord weapon that procs a debuff.  I'm so sick of ac and atk debuffs and stuns that don't even land.  Serp bite is solid, but dated.  The life saps are decent.  I'm honestly doing what I can and I have to admitt some are starting to realize how off itemization is for us, but it is very frustrating I know.  8(

[Latang]

That's cool for the ones who like it. They can buy it on ebay since it's not no-drop. Keep it up tho tast, you know we love you :)

[Bengali]

Not to mention it's another beastlord weapon that procs a debuff.  I'm so sick of ac and atk debuffs and stuns that don't even land.    8(

How are you sick of atk debuffs? :P There's only two weapons (including this one) that have them that we can use.  There's more AC debuffs, but even they aren't nearly as overused on bst gear as the level capped stuns or cold DD focii.  

The AC and atk debuffs on various weapons are the only debuffs we get (besides Roar of Thunder) that stack with other class debuffs and therefore are still useful when other classes are around.  For that reason alone they are invaluable to me personally.

[Bengali]

Oh, and just to avoid any confusion, I agree that the mace is pretty lame.  I just like the proc is all. :)

[Tastian]

It wasn't "atk debuffs" I was sick of, but rather the combination of all of them "ac debuffs and atk debuffs AND stuns that don't land".  Both AC and atk debuffs block us from crit'n.  AC debuffs are also big aggro on the proc.  Let's take a beastlord in P3 time that just got his ED and is OH'n his 1.5.  Next beastlord weapon he sees is Shinai, atk debuff, can't crit.  Next comes timeweaver which is inferior to the previous weapons, next comes JoS, oh look AC debuff and aggro, next comes spiked fists can crit, but they've got that great capped at 55th level stun on a weapon with a required 65 on it.  An atk debuff can be a nice option for a beastlord weapon, but added in with everything else it just further goes to poor weapons for a class that already has dps issues.  

Beastlord weapons:
OH 1.5
ED (a blessing and a curse lol)
HWoCM (whether it even out dps' ed depends on gear/aa)
SSB (yay ed 1.5)
Tacvi 1hb (new OH)
Crystal shinai
Fangs of serpent
2.0 (hopefully lol)

Those are weapons that are actual "upgrades" through progression.  There are some horizonal moves that can be made or maybe someone won't see a certain weapon drop so then other weapons would become an upgrade, but shinai, this mace, JoS are 3 weapons alone that have debuffs built in.  Spiked fists have that uber proc that still pisses me off everytime I look at the weapon.  That's 4 weapons going from time to omens when we've only got about 8 weapons total that are actually upgrades.  No 4 weapons isn't a lot, but it's not like beastlords have great weapon upgrades falling from the sky either.  I mean for some beastlords HWoCM MH won't even out dps an ED MH.  Going from the first two weapons (ED + 1.5) to Crystal + fangs is about a 30(ish) dps boost depending on a lot of things.  It's not just the atk debuff or just the debuffs, but the whole weapon itemization we've seen since gates of discord.  When it was just shinai having the atk debuff and some first found out they couldn't crit it most just rolled with it, but we are in need of dps upgrades and seeing even more weapons that overall are lame like this (but everyone else seems to drool over and link me constantly lol) just make me cranky again.  hehe

[Oscurro]

I got the mace last night, I haven't got to use it but I put it MH over Crystal hilted shinai hoping that the proc would make up for the ratio being worse than the shinai.  Graphic wise, it doesn't look bad. (could use a particle effect though).  Over all, I was a little disappointed when I got it and compared the two.

[Tastian]

It's a nice weapon man, and grats on it.  I think what some people are missing is what we are talking about and the relative scale though.  It's certainly one of the best weapons in the game for us.  However, weapons for us are behind to begin with and now this one is even behind where it should be relative to the other weapons that are behind to begin with.  It's not the weapon is total trash or unuseable, but rather that it's not what it should be relative to other things from omens and most of omens isn't what it should be to begin with.

[Oscurro]

After getting the shinai saturday night (low monk/bst turnout raid) and seeing the ratio I guess I expected even more from the mace.  The stats are great on both.  After raiding some last night it seems the proc goes off about as much as the shinai (mace mh, shinai oh).  I had one streak that as soon as the proc wore off it proc'd again. (wish it would do that while I'm soloing!)   I parsed a little in Riwwi and Tacvi last night.  I'm kinda curious as to what the results were.

[Bengali]

It wasn't "atk debuffs" I was sick of, but rather the combination of all of them "ac debuffs and atk debuffs AND stuns that don't land".  Both AC and atk debuffs block us from crit'n.  AC debuffs are also big aggro on the proc.  

[snip]

When it was just shinai having the atk debuff and some first found out they couldn't crit it most just rolled with it, but we are in need of dps upgrades and seeing even more weapons that overall are lame like this (but everyone else seems to drool over and link me constantly lol) just make me cranky again.  hehe

Well, as I tried to say before, I agree with all the other itemization issues, and I've hated the level capped stuns since the battle fists, but when it comes to complaining about the Anguish mace (what this topic is about), I like the proc.  It's only the second weapon in the entire game that has an atk debuff, and it's something that is useful to a beastlord imo.

In other words, I'd hate to see a petition or top 10 list or whatever else that focused on getting the proc changed, that's all.  Reading some of the posts here it's almost like some people want all our procs to be crittable DDs or lifetaps and that's it.  I like those, don't get me wrong, but there's some room for weapons with different effects.

Or to put it another way, I'm sick of level capped stuns and ratios that don't take into account our lack of double attack and an inordinate amount of cold based effects (at higher levels magic and fire seem to be where its at if you want spells to land), BUT I wouldn't lump AC and ATK debuffs in there with those because I don't think they are overused at all.

NOTE that the AC debuff on the JOS is disappointing to me because it's a Velious-era proc, not because it's an AC debuff per se.

I certainly see what you're saying about the cumulative effect, but I see some people posting as though they want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.  And I was intending to be a bit tongue-in-cheek with your statement that you were sick of atk debuffs and ac debuffs and level capped stuns -- I mean, if I have a bunch of ex-girlfriends that I can't stand calling to harass me, and Halle Berry calls me also, I wouldn't say, "I am so sick of my ex-girlfriends and Halle Berry calling me all the time to bug me."  I'd be sick of the exes, but I wouldn't be sick of Halle.  :)  That's the way I feel about Gelid Claw -- I'm sick of the level capped stuns, but not of the 300 dd/75 atk debuffs. :P

[Firriann]

Personally, i think the attack debuff is a "decent" idea. but why not change it slightly? it would be nice to have an attack drain recourse on that *shrug* i know im dreaming, but bsts dont have huge attack like rangers or monks or even wars. every little bit to raise our attack would be a small bit up on our dps, and 75 attack sure is a nice little chunk to get added to us ('course, the recourse shouldnt count against worn attack and should stack with everything :p)

[Tastian]

Beastlords do decent on atk.  I have cleared 3k while bursting.  We just don't get as much out of the atk as others because we do less melee wise and the atk doesn't boost as much of our dps(pet, nukes, procs, etc).

I think the reason lots have a problem with non-dd procs atm is because our dps is behind.  Lots of people are just trying to squeeze out whatever they can and even something like the 13% lose of proc damage due to it not criting is more than some want to give up.  I think if our dps were inline then things like atk procs or other effects would be a nice thing to have.    Some variation would be nice though(think we need more +cold dd focus items beng?).  8P

[Bengali]

(think we need more +cold dd focus items beng?).  8P

LOL, you know not to get me started on that.  :)

[Klav]

This mace is GAN
like the previously mentioned better items have been obtained in easier zones.
Take one part shinia mix with 2 parts Tacvi Weapon= KRAP
plus i dont like these procs that have after effects cuz it means all the aa spent into spell crits doesnt affect them at all.
makes me feel ive wasted aa

cant wait to see what mata muram drops..
prolly a 1hb thats better than this but can be used by a monk

Beastlords get shafted yet again.
Merry Christmas