Will Beastlords be able to bear the burden?

[Vidyne]

Well... if this needs to go in another section im sorry...   sort of a rant.. but not as graphical as I want to make it.  SoE just makes me sick sometimes.

With Shamans leaving the game by the dozens...  will beastlords be able to bear the burden of raid slowing by themselves?

Will we get disease slow, now that SoE has killed off the shaman class?

If your wondering how SoE killed off the shaman...

How bout given beastlords everything they wanted...  no offense to us... and not listening to the shamans at all.

Shamans are getting the shaft royally in the next patch, and SoE acts like its nothing.

Monks already complain about their lack of dps compared to Rogues who are infinitely more powerful than any melee class in the game atm.  Now shamans have been the same way for 6 months or more

So soe does "CLASS REINVISIONING"  and.. ooo well lets give you a new slow.. like you needed one.
Oh, we're not done yet, we noticed you liked spirit of the Leopard so much and its so popular in groups and makes you wanted again in groups..   Lets hit that with the nerf bat YEAH!
Leopard destroyed.
Ok we're gonna increase beastlord and ranger heals almost 100%, gonna give beastlords a resist check slow, Druids will still have 4k CHeals.  However, youll still sit there with your measely 1800 quick heal.. the best you can do.   

Druids and Clerics both make your quick heal laughable.
And now we're gonna make a NON Healing classes's heals so close to yours that he can theoritically replace you.

So What do shamans have that we dont have now

Disease Slow(only really useful for raiding)
Malo(with the new resist check slow for bsts, and even without it, not really useful except for raids)
Q line(nice... but clerics get the same thing, and its still not as great as actually having a real heal)
powerful dots(possibly pass the bstlord in dps, but doubtful)
Leopard(30sec or 1min reuse!  Great!  I can now put it on ONE person, maybe TWO....  OH nerfed on pets so now its not great dps on them too... well dang.. ill just delete it, something which most shamans have said theyd do)

Now lets see...
Do I want the shaman or the beastlord for my group.
The beastlord represents 1 powerful offtank and 1 weak offtank, more dps than the shaman.
The shaman can heal so slightly better than the beastlord that I wouldnt consider it.
I think I'll take the beastlord...

/Love you SoE
Im gonna love to try slowly a 100% MR mob on a raid with Shammies all gone from the game.

(SoE will respond later:  But shamans have multiple uses still, they are very powerful on raids and have not lost any functionality there)
Yeah but you destroyed their grouping ability and any hope of ever getting a group for the rest of their lives.

[DontPetBear]

Your server must be alot different from mine.  I'll pull up /lfg list and see 3-4 Bst's on it.  If i see a shammy on, it'll probably be gone by the time the button refreshes.  I haven't seen anyone that likes Bst buffs in groups.  Most will either load up their own and buff the group, or ask a guildy/friend to stop by. 

I'm pretty sure i saw that new heal costing around 500 mana a pop.  That means i'll be able to cast it about 10 times before i'm oom.  Sooo, i'll be good for one CH on the tank.  I won't be advertising myself as a back-up healer anytime soon i don't think.

Have to say that shammy spell did rock on my pet.  Probably a little over-powered but still was fun seeing those procs go through hehe.  Wish they wouldn't  lower the proc rate.

[Bengali]

There is still a lot of feeback going on with the spells on Test, and I would expect some changes based on that.

Ranger and beastlord heals were increased 70%, not 100%.

Even if shamans never slowed on raids, enchanters would take over the "primary slower" role, not beastlords.  5% makes a big difference on mobs that hit for 1000s.  Chanters would also debuff with cripple-type buffs, and mages would take over resist debuffing, along with necros who would take over poison/disease debuffing.  Clerics and druids would take over curing, with an assist from paladins.

They included shaman heals in the re-envisioning, although they haven't gotten around to it yet.  That doesn't mean they aren't going to.  They just said that they were having problems because they needed to factor slow into the equation (which is a bit of a fallacy, since clerics and druids heal against slowed mobs in groups just about as often as shamans do, and both of those classes have damage shields which are actually more effective against unslowed mobs).

[Fin Beast]

well guess I will get another little -

Man break out the violins and start playing hearts and flowers.

The only issue mentioned in the post that is not completely inane is the nerf to Leopard.

Shammy get a greater improvement to there slow that beast and Chanters, Clerics SHOULD out heal Shammy with one hand behind there back and 3 fingers missing off the free hand, Beast should out DPS Shammy as they are both mixed-classes with may uses and Shammy are the better buffer and healer, Beast and Rangers still cant heal 1/2 as well as Shammy and with Canni on Shammys its not even close.


Leopard is a tough pill to take but after seeing the parsed damage that one shammy was able to produce with it on raids, and the fact that when taking that into account the Shammy did double the DPS of anyone on the raid.....well lets just say I am not stunned that its getting reigned in.

[Mahes]

words

You have an amazingly skewed and highly inaccuracte perception of other classes, their roles, and their current spells, sir.

[Grbage]

It is way to early to be knee jerking over this. For one it is on "test", that means it may or may not make it to the live servers as is. Secondly, this is the first round of changes not the last. Maybe they will take this away from shammies and give them something spectacular to replace it.  Try and reign in the bad attitude and wait a bit to see how things shake out.

[Vidyne]

sorry for ruffling feathers, just had about 5 shaman friends that will probably quit after this goes live.

Beasts would take over slowing(slowing on inc) on raids because enchanters need to mezz mobs first, worry about slowing later.

Shamans should be outhealed by clerics, but Druids get 2400 heal, compared to shaman's 1800, and also get a 4800 cheal which shamans dont get..  Many shamans have said they can not play role of main healer in group, they are backup healers.

Now as backup healers, whats the difference between 1100 and 1800?  700 yes... but is that enough to bring a shaman over a beast... in most groups.   When beasts do more dps.

That was all I was saying, sorry for not being more clear

[Lizsolo]

Druids and Clerics both make your quick heal laughable.
And now we're gonna make a NON Healing classes's heals so close to yours that he can theoritically replace you.

Kudos to you.  You've brightened a rather dim day.  That's some funny shit there.

[Maylian]

In my experience Beasts (myself) quite often slow raid trash often anyways. And it is this trash which our new slow is meant to help us on. The new slow we get isn't going to automatically make shamans redundant when i'm raiding in Qvic, Time or Riftseekers, its going to allow me to fulfill the reason we get groups in those zones. And allow us to just relieve a bit of pressure off the other slowers. If you have shamans quitting over a fix then in my opinion they should go, shamans with OoW got a much needed boost to their groupability. OoW buffs are amongst the most wanted shamans have ever been with these, group FA, overstat buffs, avoidance and dmg mods. Beasts got a new focus............

With the fact that druids out heal shamans, why shouldn't they? They don't have the other functions of a shaman.....Druids can snare, nuke, semi-dot and heal. Well Shamans have better dot's, better HoT's and a semi-decent quick heal. Again i've never seen a cleric play a main healer in a group and I wouldn't really expect them to either. Not sure but doesn't the new "stance" apply to shamans as well so they can either be offensive, defensive or neutral. Increasing healing power, DPS or just being the "standard" shaman.

I often prefer seeing a shaman in my group over a druid. With HoT's and insta heals I feel they're more equipped to back up heal. More often than not in groups i'm in an extra healer isn't for the tank but for other group members that have got riposted, over agro'd or got hit by an AE.

I honestly don't see how a fix to 1 spell line is a nerf........seeing your pet cast that spell upwards of once a second is a bit too much of a DPS increase.  And not entirely sure where the comment "How bout given beastlords everything they wanted" can come from.

This re-envisionment isn't about giving everyone what they want. Its about allowing a class to function as the game originally intends and as far as I'm concerned Shamans have only gained from OoW and this upcoming update.

Just my 2pence.......

[Vidyne]

/shrug.. its not the proc rate on pet nerf im talking about.. 

Its the 1min recast time they stuck on a 1min duration spell supposedly on test(Leopard)

and no one seemed to get the idea here...

Shamans will be less preferred for exp groups, as beasts gain favor in exp groups with new healing(this was the comment made to me by multiple shamans, who i tried to comfort)

With shamans less preferred for groups, they will not progress as much as beasts, get disheartened, and quit the game.

Eventually that will lead to very few shamans playing EQ.
That was the point they/me were trying to make.

I still think they do ok...
Id like to see Leopard returned to no recast time
Id like to see a bump in their final(Non-Raiding) 1800 quick heal, maybe 2400 instead.
Or give them some sort of heal thats more than 2k...  a 3200 cheal  8 sec cast?

Thats just the point im trying to make... shamans are complaining/afraid that they will be replaced by beasts in exp groups alot more with these changes.  And if shamans are replaced in exp groups.. you will see them die out.... and the place you truely absolutely need shamans...  mobs who need disease slow.. places where malo and their other unique talents are useful...   you wont have them.

Guess I sorted posted with wrong wording in the original post and gave folks the wrong idea, and I'm sorry for that.
Just wanted to know what would happen if Shamans were gone.

[BriguyFV]

Last week I was LFG for 5 hours, and never once saw a Shaman LFG in that time. Did see 5 beastlies at one time LFG.

So shove your whinning up your ass, "poor shamans :cry:" cry me a river. We need to be more affective in groups  :|.

[Raedwolf]

So am I understanding that someone thinks we Beasts will be preferred OVER a shaman now? Personally, I see us as being one of those jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none types. Sure, we get a new slow; 65% with a -30 resist, compared to the shaman's 75% with a -60. We get to heal now for 1165 base, single-cast, fairly big mana drain; you think that somehow compares to a shaman's Yoppa's Mending, with a base of 1785, or their Spiritual Serenity, healing 820/tick x 4 ticks =3280? Our single-target Infusion of Spirit and Stamina somehow stacks up to their Wunshi's/Fortitude? And where do we have anything like Spirit of Sense, or Spirit of Might? Anyone for a SoW versus a Bih'li? Want some Ferine Avatar? Need that mob rooted? Oh, that's right, we don't have those.

Come on.

We can never replace shaman, just like they can't replace us. Can either of us fill some of the other's abilities? Sure. But trying to compare the two classes is really an apples and oranges scenario.

Oh, and btw, according to Lucy, at http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhistory.html?id=6735&source=Test, it's a 30-second recast time.

[Doomringer]

I think your friends need to grow up a little, and look at the game as a whole and not just their little corner of it. I have seen the Shammy complaint list and it is mostly about what other classes have similar to theirs no matter how diminished it really is.

Beastlord/Chanter resist modified slow--- These classes have a really hard time slowing in new higher level content, Chanters are an aggro nightmare when they are chain casting spells. Beasts sometimes take too long to do the job. Shammies are still better at it and they have heals and buffs that neither competing class have. The complaint is....They will no longer be needed, but maybe more people will actually explore more content  because they do not have to wait for a Shammy to go LFG. We would all love to jump on LFG tool and be sent a tell in a few mins to go to the best places the gamne has to offer because our class can be trusted to do the job.

Chanter reduced hate Tash----- See above please.

Paladin/Beast/Ranger improved heals----I am pretty sure Paladins are not going to stop tanking to be MH for groups. As previously stated with Shammy regen and sheer healing power no Beast/Ranger is gonna compete with that. Plus they have not seen everything planned for the class, why bitch about what has not even been finished yet?

Leopard nerf----Previous post said it all. The spell came out and everyone loved it. In the end it just put too much power into one classes hands.  It is hard to taste real power and have it taken away from you. Their reaction is why it is being taken away in the first place. It will be taken to full advantage and the game will be ruined.

I hope the Shammy community wakes up. This game needs them. They got a great boost in the last two expansions and now they got one spell touched they scream boody murder and ignore the fact that they are not the only ones getting nerfed because of that spell.

All the Pet classes got nerfed to make pets proc less. This sucks because alot of our procs have effects attched to them like stun or snare. But as usual it is all about what one class wants and not caring what the effects are to the rest of the gaming community..

[Latang]

What doombringer said. Nicely put dude.

[Urim]

Shamans will be less preferred for exp groups, as beasts gain favor in exp groups with new healing

Any groups who chooses a beastlord over a shaman because of a beastlords healing ability needs to get their head checked.

I will agree that the Nerfbat (tm) struck hard with the panther/leopard lines but something had to be done. 30sec/1min recast is going overboard but i think a 10-15 sec recast would be more in line. Having zero recast was nice for the power boosts but nobody can honestly say it wasnt overpowered.

Shamans aren't as hard up as they lead you to believe. The have best slow in game, some of the best stat/hp buffs in game, third ranked healer, their HoTs are amazing, they have the best self mana regen in game so are less hampered by their mana pools which makes them powerful, their dots are amazing and when stacked can produce pretty good dps numbers. Hell, they can solo better than us in a lot of places, so that alone says something about their abilities.

To anybody quitting the game over these changes, all i have to say to them is "Don't let the door hit you on the way out". Whiners like them make the game worse so i won't shed any tears.