changes to new spells on lucy

[Meritt]

I get the feeling from reading here that everyone seems to be under the impression that Kragg and IoS don't stack.

They do.

Kragg, IoS, Furious Str, Dexterity, Stamina

All of those spells stack.

hp +395
str +84
dex +105
sta +85

You don't get as much HP as focus, but you get more str/dex/sta than Focus.  Although I think that's irrevalent, because if a Shaman is in the group, you wouldn't use IoS most likely anyway.


Nobody asks for IoS?  It's because nobody knows the spell exists.  Hell, most Shamans <60 when I ask for IoS... I get Harnessing <sighs>

Nobody knows what the hell IoS does, or knows that it stacks with Kraggs + direct stat buffs.  It stacks with EVERYTHING except Shammy Focus buffs. That's it.  Everything else that you would encounter.

I personally will love group IoS.  If a Shaman isn't around, it'll be very much sought after.

[EmrysX]

agreed dios. The new AAs, group ios, new nuke, new dot...all good stuff!

[Jkal_Shihar]

Ditto, im with Dios on this as well.

[DiosT]

No merrit, the conflict is between..

-group Kragg
-group IoS


Some feel group IoS is useless, and want group Kragg
Some feel group Kragg is useless, and want IoS to remain

and lucy just posted Beastlial Alignment upgrades as im posting this.
1) it doesnt last as long as Sav or Fer (thats not even including the use of focus items and most likely because its an AA focus items wont increase it)
2) 180 atk vs 150 atk | both have 40 sta | 70 resist vs 65 resist
a 30 atk upgrade? are the developers listening to beta buff beastlords or can someone really tell me where the hell these people come up with a +30 atk and +5 resist is gonna sell someone.
Hey how about them berserkers...

You arn't in beta, so you don't know what's going on in beta right now... that's fine... but unfortunatly it's a one-sided attack because it would break Non-Disclousure agreements to fight it...


But basically... does the fact it still has a mana cost, and is 90% identicle to Ferocity still, weigh in at all in telling you they arn't done messing with AA's yet?




Also, while other classes are getting 'better spells'... almost all of them are Higher DPS, less Efficency.. the fact we are getting BETTER DPS for SAME efficency is pritty damn good...


Look at the cleric heals, they are the exact same efficency as the spell they are upgrading.. they arn't much 'better' then the spell they are upgrading... ITS THE SAME FOR OUR SPELLS TO...

Clerics are getting no Efficency increase from the new spells, but the spells are getting slightly better

Scorpion Venom -> Ukan Blood, More damage, Same efficency.. and unlike heals, we can STACK the 2 spells for even more damage at a nice efficency rating
Frost Spear -> Trushar's, Same efficency, better damage.. can pop out the  old pre-60 DD and put this in it's place...



With 2 spells like this, i dont care what the 3rd spell is, as long as it's useful in more than 2 zones[/quote]

[Tastian]

I really like the new nuke.  Although it's still down on efficency verse what the rest of the line prior to frost spear was (3 to 1).  The new dot is a minor upgrade because almost no one is ever going to be throwing out double scorp venoms and if they do not for long.  However, I do see how nice it is.

Group infusion is nice, but it's purely a convinence upgrade, a convinence that many won't use believe it or not.  I like the idea, but as a 65 spell that will at most save me ~30 seconds and maybe some mana, but mana during buff time that I'll likely have totally regened before I do anything.  Seeing it have some atk 8P mmmmm wishful thinking sure.  I hate to mention other classes but in this case I think it fits, rangers have a new 480(ish) heal at 65 for 195 mana 3.0 casting time.  Rng/bst have always had the exact same heals and regen at levels and that will now be gone if this goes live.

If it really were between group infusion and group kragg, then yeah I'd say group infusion is going to be more used by the most beastlords overall, but it's a 65 spell and more and more people are going to be maxing stats.  I guess the fact that it's currently a 65 spell and doesn't upgrade any new stats is what's really throwing me.  I personally would love a new heal as I heal more than some paladins I know, but *shrugs*.

[Nalitra]

I'm happy with the new nuke and dot.  They are small upgrades to our current versions, which expansion spells have always been about.  

How useful Infusion of Spirit vs Kragg vs neither, depends I believe completely on your play style.  For a high end raiding beastlord, both IoS and Kragg are pretty useless.  For those who are often buffing their groups, either would be nice.  

I fall into the category of high end raiding.  My RL husband is also a level 65 shaman so I am very, very seldom grouped without a shaman.  If IoS is what we end up with, then I'll get it and bury it somewhere in my book for those once in a blue moon occasions when I have to buff a group.  

I am going to agree completely with Tastian here.  Beast heals and ranger heals have always gone hand in hand with each other.  I am very surprised SOE is breaking away from that now.  

I think the new heal rangers are getting would be great to have.  It is a spell I would use often.  It is a spell that would be handy whether your a high end raiding beast, a soloing beast, or a casual LDON grouper.  

As it stands now though, 2 out of 3 of our spells are nice so I'm happy enough.  Also, we will have a mixed bag of AA's so all-in-all, not a bad expansion for beastlords.  

Nalitra
65 Feral Lady

[Mahes]

Just wanted to add my thoughts on the new spells for kicks.  I'm in Beta, but due to PoT being down (where the betabuff 65 BST is) and Mahes not being transfered, I haven't done much.  So I'm not 100% on what's going on there.  Anyways...

The new nuke is very nice and will be the spell I focus on obtaining first given the current line up.  I do think it needs to be raised just a tad to be more efficient, but it will be nice to replace the pre-60 nuke.  Personally I always have the top 2 DDs loaded and use them as they refresh, so this spell appeals to me.  Having a focus for it, in game, is even better...though I'd rather see a focus for one of our more mana-intensive spells.  But no complaints there.

The DoT...honestly, I couldn't care less.  It's more or less right there with Pack Shrew.  I don't use DoTs unless I'm trying to solo some beefy named mob or something.  They just don't mix well with groups when you're got multiple pulls and are mezzing.  Mobs die to fast to DoT in general.  Plus, and I could be wrong, but last time I checked they weren't as efficient as nukes.  It's great for those that use them, I suppose.

Group IoS...Ok, again this is from my point of view and how I play.  IoS is the spell I cast on my warder.  Period.  I haven't self-buffed IoS in about 5 months.  Stats are maxed so the spell's useless.  My guild is familiar with it.  They know what it does.  Yet only once in a blue moon will I get a request for it from a cleric who wants to melee.  When your guild is Time capable, odds are these stats are capped or easily buffed to cap without IoS, due to gear.  I do, however, get requests for Kragg often when shamans aren't around.  I also always have this buff up.  I'd vote Group Kragg from my standpoint because it has more potential to benefit me and my group.  All that in mind...neither would be make or break for me.  Just handy.

As for the Ancient spell, I've already posted somewhere that I'd prefer an ancient version of SD.  It's our defining spell and it has no stacking issues like SV does.  Now I know the Ancient spells in the past weren't game-breaking and were only minor upgrades, so I can see the logic in the Ancient SV, but it's not overly appealing as this is a buff I never use on raids.  I would, however, love a 10 mana/hp per tick SD.  Sure it's only 1 more but it adds up, and yes, as someone posted before, when you're raiding you're already regen'n mana like mad....but this spell would have a lot of appeal beyond raids.

Again, this is all from my perspective and I know not all BSTs are Time flagged or have stats capped(not trying to brag).  Just wanted to add my two cents as it pertains to me in hopes that maybe the devs will take it into consideration.

**Edit** Just wanted to add, as the above posters, I would go nuts over a  new heal.  It could be just a 50 point increase over chloro(though who wouldn't like more?) and I'd be all over it.  As someone who duos / solos a lot, and even back up heals on raids and groups thanks to healing AAs, this would be an incredible spell for me.

[DiosT]

Beta Beastlords...

You need to be careful on how you say things, being in Beta you are bound to a NDA agreement.. and arn't allowed to give 'personal experience' with the expansion until it is released, and the majority of the NDA agreement is lifted...

Need to stick with data from the spell files, and publicly accessable material..


Yes I know it's annoying, makes it hard to support your opinion, but :-/ well, I go behind the NDA 100%, and I have no problems with censorship when someone is violating the law (NDA is a legally binding contract)



Anyway, I'll feedback the idea of replacing group IOS with the heal to get the idea on their table..

[DiosT]

Also, I included a request that if they dont want to give us the heal to make Group IoS a tad better

[Razimir]

IoS is totally useless for elemental geared bst and so would be grp version.

-Raz

[Silverak]

I would guess that on my server that 75-80% of all 65 bsts are not elemental flagged, myself included.  For us group IoS would an incredible boost.  That's kinda why they would put it in you know.  Way too many people think the game revolves around the end game but it doesn't.  Try to keep that in mind.

[DiosT]

I would guess that on my server that 75-80% of all 65 bsts are not elemental flagged, myself included.  For us group IoS would an incredible boost.  That's kinda why they would put it in you know.  Way too many people think the game revolves around the end game but it doesn't.  Try to keep that in mind.

What I was gonna say to respond to razimir...

There are people other than elemental flagged beastlords...

the DD should work well for them, and so should the DoT outside raids...

[Mahes]

I would guess that on my server that 75-80% of all 65 bsts are not elemental flagged, myself included.  For us group IoS would an incredible boost.  That's kinda why they would put it in you know.  Way too many people think the game revolves around the end game but it doesn't.  Try to keep that in mind.

I definitely try to keep this in mind and hope my post didn't reflect otherwise.  I was simply trying to approach it from my point of view with the information I know and the game as I play it.

In my opinion, group IoS should have been a given.  It shouldn't have been single target or they should have made it a pre-60 spell with group at 64 or 65.  But they didn't.  I can see how the reduction in mana would be nice to a non-EP BST.  I can't access Lucy, but I'm trying to recall if IoS was more or less mana per cast than Kraggs.  That would certainly make a difference in which of the two you'd prefer to be able to group buff.

I think ideally we'd get a group IoS as a gimme in addition to the heal.  We've always been on par with rangers for heals and I'd like to see that remain.

[Klav]

Heres are some spells that would be more of a benefit than the ones theyve created.

Khura's Focusing-Beastlords would get their buff need plus hp which doesnt leave the spell to be useless by players with max stats.
Voice of the Beserker-bring Frenzy spell back into beastlords.
Bane of Nife-If i wanted a dot give it some muscle atleast.
Remove Greater Curse-we should have had this with the rest of the classes.
And here to satisfy the role playing beastlord who wants their own spell line.

Sha's Determination-Some kind of spell focus for pet heals and pc healings.
Sha's Experiment- DR slow 65%-Keeps Shaman slows still at the helm and beastlords as a back up.
Ancient Khati Sha's Meditation- Spiritual Dominion upgrade

and i just thought of these off the top of my head as i posted this.

the development that these guys are thinking on is low. there are plenty of things to have than group infusion of spirit.

[Pojodan]

Heres are some spells that would be more of a benefit than the ones theyve created.

Khura's Focusing-Beastlords would get their buff need plus hp which doesnt leave the spell to be useless by players with max stats.
Voice of the Beserker-bring Frenzy spell back into beastlords.
Bane of Nife-If i wanted a dot give it some muscle atleast.
Remove Greater Curse-we should have had this with the rest of the classes.
And here to satisfy the role playing beastlord who wants their own spell line.

Sha's Determination-Some kind of spell focus for pet heals and pc healings.
Sha's Experiment- DR slow 65%-Keeps Shaman slows still at the helm and beastlords as a back up.
Ancient Khati Sha's Meditation- Spiritual Dominion upgrade

and i just thought of these off the top of my head as i posted this.

the development that these guys are thinking on is low. there are plenty of things to have than group infusion of spirit.

Focus:  No, we are not duel wielding shaman, they get the easyt buffs, we get the DPS.    Besides, I click off Khura's the instant it's cast on me.. IoS+Kragg+STR/STA/DEX is considerably better.

VotB: I agree here.. Frenzy is decisively old hat, further behind every other spell line we share with shaman...  If not VotB, then just a Beastlord-only upgrade to Frenzy, perhaps with a small ATK component.

Bane of Nife and RGC: No, again we're not duel wielding Shaman, our current DoTs (Along with the new one upcoming) are sufficient for our needs... I can see Remove Curse, simply because it has mild usefulness bit really isn't all that great... sort of a 'woops' cure kinda like Counteract Poison


Heal focus:  Eeeeh.. already a number of Healing focuses for everyone to use.. we're not healers by trade.. perhaps a Healing of Sorsha only spell haste so it's actually useable in the heat of battle would be nice.

DR-based slow: Eeeeh... I'm iffy about giving up any sort of leg up over shaman or even an equal footing.. they're the kings of slowing, we're the squires who also have a ferocious animal pet and a mean streak.  

Upgrades Dominion:  10 hp/mana I can definately see.. not a huge boost, but sweet none-the-less... certainly more sppealing than improved Vigor (Even though I'm drooling for this one, too)