changes to new spells on lucy

[Klav]

http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spell.html?id=4874&source=Test

check the stacking please.
this from the looks of it does not stack with e bolt kthx!

forget your number crunching please.

[Murkk Dakruul]

Really the only time I have problems with our nukes is in PoW. No way im using DoT's on hydrotha, the tanks have a hard enough time holding aggro on him already. They won't be getting used on coirnav, the fight ends by the time FoS and our damage disc runs out.

I guess I can use em on KtM and ofassaa, woo woo. I do actually use them to solo sometimes, but seeing as we are getting only a few spells in this expansion, I personally would like spells that would atleast get used once a day.

Same thing as Tytallia, I have a 30% cold focus so I may be biased. You can't crit DoT's, and for me they only get used if the DD's are getting resisted. They cause to many problems to be worth it, Aggro(more than the DD's), Will break mez's, cause problems when mobs need to be blurred and unless they do full damage they arn't as efficient as the nukes.

I'm wondering if other people do use the DoT's. I'm perfectly fine with getting one if enough people use them, I personally don't use them much, but if most bst's do i'm all for it.

[Aldur]

A second dot is useful on raids.  Its application within an xp group situation is limited because of the simple fact that very few xp mobs in full groups survive for 50 seconds.

On raids there are numerous times when the second dot could be used (after experimenting with agro to make sure it could be cast).  On virtually all boss mobs I cast scorpion venom, I do watch my agro closely and its very hard to control - but after a little bit of dying (on minor raids where it doesn't matter if you turn and get killed) you should be able to use it.

On mobs where melee is of less use due to insane ae's or ae round target (We do TZ by spreading out round the target and using range nukes/dot's) or mobs such as the stage 2 boss on the way to agnarr where you can melee but you get hit for a reasonable amount of damage unless you do alot of running out of melee range, or you can dot out of range (nukes don't work on that boss).

When you absolutely must have agro but you have no time to do it.  I have been SA (two group clearing style) for how we uniquely do berty ring.  I have to agro as quickly as possible in a 2 hour executioner trial type thing.  Often I will slow and then break mez (if it has one) with the largest agro spell we have (scorpion venom at present).  I largely imagine that the new spell will be even more agro.

Lastly dot stacking - pretty much all non attribute changing dot's now stack.  Dot's that are on the stacking issues bit of lucy do indeed stack, so I am confident that ukun's blood will likewise stack.

Don't get me wrong trushar's breath is far and away the pick of the bunch, I use nukes an incredible amount - but also on certain raids dots are golden(VT is great for dot's because of the long fight durations and difficulty of melee and AC of the mobs) .

A spell doesn't have to be used 100% of the time by everyone for it to be a worthwhile addition.

[Tytallia]

You're 65 Klav and didn't know DoTs stack? Erm... now you know enjoy! :wink:

[Klav]

ive been playing a beastlord since week 1 of luclin
and leveling using my pet CH as often as i could i had no reason to use dots.
and now at my level i still have rarely used them because usually i am asked to slow and heal.
and still even in my lack of knowledge, i wouldnt use it because
1) the area of soloing is fading away
2) getting super agro from fast acting dots is not what i need
3) If i need agro i would trust sha's advantage.
4)in pvp i have tried them and frown each time for wasted mana on resist checks.
On raids(especially tallon zek) ive learned its best to play it safe when it comes to damage.You dont need heroes-you need smart players.My mana usage is diposed off in other areas due to main healers in CH lines and what not.Again thank you for the nice update but really; Your Tainted Breath spell has worn off on Quarm? I really shake my head at that. I still frown at the idea that i am supposed to be  casting lvl 49 shaman spells on Quarm let alone a lvl 14 shaman spell even if it had a chance at landing.

[Kharaf]

You know what would make the dot worth casting in an exp group?

If they could cut the mana cost and duration in half.  Keep the same ratio.  It would still be the same dps increase,  it would now go from being totaly inefficient to only mildly inefficient compared to our nukes.

[Dummkopf]

In normal groups i have one dot and 2 nukes loaded, however i use mostly one nuke and one dot (the cast time on the second nuke is too long to be efficient). In PoW i use a mage summoned dot focus and our 4 highest dots, sick them all in for mini bosses and keep them til he is dead. If the tank survives i have no aggro problem at all, if there is a tank change i will most probably get summoned once or twice and i can survive up to 4 summons (if my healer is fast enough). I can even melee between recasts without aggro problems (major that is, i might get on rampage but i can take it), but i will probably not survive a tank change :) Since we dont use pets on Boss mobs in PoW i can max my dps this way.

Id like to see a higher damage dot and a higher damage nuke as well (and i dont care about efficiency in regard to mana), too bad i only have a 30 cold nuke focus and no burning affliction one other than the mage summoned bracelet.

[Shere Khaan]

Why would they replace the nuke with group kragg?  I think the people feedbacking are talking about replacing group ios with group kragg instead, based on which of those would be used more (neither may be often, but one of them is better than the other to a lot of people) OR replacing group ios with a heal.

I think both are completely useless personally. I would rejoice if neither of them existed, I only suggested a group kragg to exaggerate how silly group IoS is to me. The fact that people thought it was a serious request fills me with despair  :roll:

Shere Khaan

[Ukator Iceblood]

Shere you must never group shaman, or you and your friends are past it. Group IoS will be as useful to me as any spell in the game. I never use ProtofCaliv, if they added an Ancient Spell I would never see it, I don't use DoTs, and probably wont change that with the new one. However I see the uses for these to others, just because I won't use, see or need doesn't mean that its bad for them to be out there.

[Scalewulf]

I'll use the dots in my 3 man kiting group with my Necro and Shammy buddies.  

Are they awesome, no..
...but can they be useful, yes.  

This class has always been about it's utility and flexability, I for one am glad that our flexability is not changing.  

Group IoS will be great for me.  LDoN, I rarely use a shammy.  And yes, everyone wants IoS that didn't already hit up a shammy for fucus.

:wink:

[Tirshatha]

If they took our nuke for a group kragg I would quit playing this game instantly. Best not to even put ideas in their heads. Stick with the improved heal like rangers.

Why would they replace the nuke with group kragg? I think the people feedbacking are talking about replacing group ios with group kragg instead, based on which of those would be used more (neither may be often, but one of them is better than the other to a lot of people) OR replacing group ios with a heal.

Is it etched in stone somewhere that we can only have 3 spells for this expansion and that we must choose carefully which ones we get? Why can't we get a new DoT, new nuke, Group Infusion of Spirit AND Group Kragg? Seems a simple enough solution to me. Combining kragg and IoS wouldn't do us much good as it would have the same conflicts focus has now (ie. caster and cleric self buffs.) If they're going to give us a group version of one then they should give us a group version of the other. Kragg and IoS are our ghetto focus, they're like peanut butter and jelly, they just go together. Can't think of any reason they can't give us both.

I'm generally happy with the new nuke and dot. I find them both to be situational spells. When I'm in a raid or group where the average lifespan of a mob is measured in seconds I'll use nukes to get some quick damage in. If I'm soloing or in a group where I'm the main tank I'll load up all my dots and use them to keep agro and lay down some good constant damage. Also there are some raid encounters where DoTs would be more effective. These are mostly luclin encounters, especially Vex Thall named, where fights last several minutes and the main tank has good solid agro. Just be sure to keep in mind that mobs only have 30 buff slots. If you just stuck Sicken on Aten Ha Ra and the necro's Blood of Thule "won't take hold" your being more of a hinderance than a help.

What I'm most dissapointed with is the total lack of creativity with our spells. It seems to me that these spells were thrown together because SoE wanted another bullet point to tack onto their sales pitch.

[Tytallia]

Just be sure to keep in mind that mobs only have 30 buff slots. If you just stuck Sicken on Aten Ha Ra and the necro's Blood of Thule "won't take hold" your being more of a hinderance than a help.

Exactly why I'm forbidden to DoT on raid mobs; our weaker stuff blocks better shaman/necro/whoever DoTs.

[Dummkopf]

I only saw once the no-hold-message on a mob, normally its not a problem at all to stick dots and debuffs in, never get complaints about doting and there is no rule in our guild about it. The point is still a valid one though.

[mrowrr]

I think that beasts should be getting a similar heal as rangers.  I don't know many rangers in my guild who have put any time into getting the healing aax's or the crit heals(case in point Rathe fight 2 rangers in my group, both tossing non aax enforced healing yet both have over 300aax), yet every beast in my guild made it a priority to get those aax's early on and find ourselves firing off 509 heals and 1018 crits and some with improved healing are doing much more than that.  On some fights the beasts are used for fill in healing and it only makes sense, my guild makes sure to spread the beasts around for that exact purpose.  

I think it would be a huge oversight if sony didn't give us a similar heal.  I could care less about group IOS actually :)  The only people that want it on raids these days are clerics and 9 our of 10 times our clerics only need a single cast it on them not group cast.