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Started by Tastian, November 17, 2006, 01:14:22 PM

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Tardar

QuoteHaving and extra paragoon would be great, i can see no downside to this at all.

You answered your own question.

QuoteMaking paragoon scale properly > adding this new ability imo.

Adding this new ability, that will be on the same timer as paragon simply gives them an excuse to ignore the bazillion AA we have spent to get our currently crappy skill.  What will the chances be then that any scaleing will ever be done?  This fits Sony's MO to a T.  Remember double experience?  Always pointing to something else so the masses won't pay attention to their previous shortcomings. 

Given that paragon hasn't scaled properly, how long will it be before this new skill doesn't scale also?  What are we averaging?  2 expansions a year?  This time next year and this new skill will be all but worthless and we will have wasted another billion AA for the privelage. 

Rarrum

Single target.. not too fond of that idea.

However.. removing it's ability to be MGB'd would be acceptable, since back when we first were gifted with Paragon, that wasn't possible.  As long as /tgb still works.

Removing the MGB'able flag and trippling (at the least) the effects would be a decent tradeoff.

Sikkem

Single target, not interested I agree in that a year it will be broken.
Group non-mgb not overly interested in that either same as above.

I would like my current one upgraded/fixed, unlike most I still use it on raids. Mostly raids we are attempting and havent won yet or only won once but some raids also like daosheen when we are light on numbers and healers poppinging near the end can make the difference.


Sikkem - 90 Beastlord - Bertox

Mewzee

Paragon: current <----this needs a huge upgrade before I bother casting it mgb to a raid whose doing demiplane/deathknell and TSS progression

Perfection: 4x current, no mgb, yes tgb <---if with tgb it would allow it to cast on the group the bst is in and a 2nd group the bst has targeted, then....mayyybe i'd use it..hehe

Aura: 10x current, single target <-----single target would suck...make it group only better..the good thing about that is we'd be a mana battery for wizzys and mages if they stuck us in a group with them or with clerics and the MT...the bad thing is you'd miss out on being in a shammy/rogue/ranger/zerker group and miss out on dps benefits from shammy panther/champ.

They look like interesting ideas, but I can tell you now that I most likely wouldn't use them at all in raids except the last one. My raiding has me use ALOT of AoS as a HOT for hps and mana mostly for healers and nukers...I agree i'd love to see END regen added mostly for warriors and other melee due to how much End they use

I do agree thou, that this awesome utility has been getting left behind and now with OOCR it sucks to not be able to cast it after a wipe/recovery b/c everyone is just sitting and in 2mins or less they are FM/FHP/F END.



~Mewzee Mew~  Lvl 75 Wildblooded Kitty of RIP ~ Tribunal Server

Fightclubx

I'm not even remotely interested in paragon at all. a single target on 15min timer is really of no use to me on a raid -- thats my opinion anyway, when clerics or whoever start going OOM i'm sure even an upgraded single target paragon STILL isnt gonna do much for them. (would still like to see it as an instant cast as well anyway)

personally i'd like to get away from the whole paragon thing and focus on the fero line. EQ allready has 3 mana batteries, necro's,  bards, and mod rods -- let them keep the job.

othern then avatar/champion were the only class with a large atk boosting buff. I'd like to see that buff actually worth its weight in mana.

Khauruk

Single target paragon could be really nice if it was, say, 10k mana, given to a wizard.  They could do some really nice things w/ that.....
TURNCOAT!!!!!

Petts

well ... i use my mgb paragon on several raids and would like to be
able to still use it ... an upgrade would be a nice bonus, otherwise
leave it alone.  more mana and a raid wide hot is always welcome,
no matter the target ... we have used a paragon rotation to over
come some targets till we had the raid force geared up better.

5 beast using an mgb'ed paragon can make a big difference on long fights. imho.

Gxser

Leave it as a MGB Group buff . Add Endurance , raise HP/Mana regen on it so that it actually makes sense and is a benefit like it is supposed to be .
G

80 Bst

Luclin

! Greater  than no one as good as any !

Gimp Gear

Mewzee

Echoing the last two posters here...hehehe..especially Petts, his exact situation is what I have always used AoS or old Paragon/Purrfection for, so I really am all for KEEPING this ability.


~Mewzee Mew~  Lvl 75 Wildblooded Kitty of RIP ~ Tribunal Server

Urim

Quote from: Gxser
Leave it as a MGB Group buff . Add Endurance , raise HP/Mana regen on it so that it actually makes sense and is a benefit like it is supposed to be .
As long as its MGBable it will never be the benefit that we think it should be. This is because the devs will base what they feel it should do with the thinking that its going to be on 54 people instead of the normal 6.
Maelin Starpyre
[80 Arch Animist] Urim the Library Guardian (Iksar) <Crimson Tempest>

'Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity'

Humlaine

its sad but true  :-(

Sanois

#41
Why not make it variable? This is just an idea and can be modified.  These numbers are based off of Paragon of Spirit.

Max Potential (72 People)                  
HP   Mana   Ticks   Total HP   Total Mana   Raid HP   Raid Mana
200   80   6   1200   480   86400   34560
                  
54 Person Raid (Most common raid size)                  
HP   Mana   Ticks   Total HP   Total Mana   Raid HP   Raid Mana
267   107   6   1600   640   86400   34560
                  
18 Minimum People to make a raid                  
HP   Mana   Ticks   Total HP   Total Mana   Raid HP   Raid Mana
800   320   6   4800   1920   86400   34560


Ok I give up for now. I can't get the table to work. but I think you can see where the numbers should line up.

Khauruk

#42
I don't think there's any mechanism in place to vary the efficacy of the buff based upon how many it's cast on.

Problems with your numbers:
72 person raid - ignore this, as almost nobody is raiding PoP and prior fulltime, and no raiding guild is going to be planning for more than 54.  We shouldn't be gimping it unnecessarily...

Make the 18 person one MGBable, and I'd be happy.

/tgbable 7k mana at top end

Single target - 10k+ mana, maybe even more.  You'd need to extend the timer on it though, for sure.  I guess not such a big deal now w/ ooc regen and vet AAs now, though.....
TURNCOAT!!!!!

Sanois

We can't ignore the 72 person raid because that is what SOE is saying makes these types of MGBable AAs too powerful.  They are looking at the Total Maximum Potential of the ability.  That is why I put the 72 person raid in there.

Khauruk

Quote from: Sanois on February 10, 2007, 12:35:27 AM
We can't ignore the 72 person raid because that is what SOE is saying makes these types of MGBable AAs too powerful.  They are looking at the Total Maximum Potential of the ability.  That is why I put the 72 person raid in there.

We assume they are.  They offered no real response to any queries I saw last beta.

Not to mention, if they are basing it off of 72 people, we need to convince them how it needs to be centered around the 54 or fewer person current content that exists.
TURNCOAT!!!!!