The List

[Khauruk]

Khauruk, maybe you should read what I posted again?

You asked why people 'cared' about combat effects

There has always been the defensive (well, I see resists as defensive) component to the spell

I'm sorry...I didn't notice the bit about self-buff, and I should have specified about CE as it would apply to ferocity.  /bonks self.  As far as Ferocity being a defensive buff as well, I have been sending PMs to developers to try and get some further development on that front as well....so yes, I am aware.

[Bumkus]

I disagree with the "no new DoT's" mantra.

In a kiter's game, this is our only version of sustained ranged DPS.  Without dot's our soloability is right up there with rogues.

[jitathab]

Our solo ability has gone down not due to getting crappy dots. It is due to that we tank like crap. As mobs DPS has increased and max hit increased our tanking has not kept pace. So we are relegated to killing the gimper mobs for lousy rewards.

Dots were only used by a select few for kiting and have never really been a core ability. TBH you can get some good results by nuke kiting, just like wizards and BATM.

So ditch dots, more poison nukes and a new ice nuke.

[hokarz]

I would like to see a self rune, or self only ac buff that stacks with everything else in game. Do we even have a self only ac buff, other than the kunark tunic clicky? I'm still using that...so sad.

Upgrade to SE.

Definately a group haste a la talisman of celerity.

another pet/beast short-term damage modifying like the one I never got because of 69.4 :(

[TabarQuell]

1- Ferocity, do something with it, be it making it useful, or pitching it out the window.

2- Pet Survivability / DPS in raid settings, the Focuses from raid level need to make the warder able to endure raid level encounters, be it some heavy Mitigation/Avoidance to AE ramp, or decent sized shielding, as melee damage is what destroys the pet more than spell effects.

3- SE- 13 mana/hp per tick with 1000hp items? compared to the 7/tick it was with 150-200hp items could use a big boost.

4- Paragon 400 hp / 140 mana per tick for 6-8 ticks, was 200 / 80 at inception. looking for a big boost here too to keep up with mudflation (see point #3)

5- Growl upgrade. Damage component is fine (+20% scales indefinitely) increased HoT (300-500) with an increased hp boost (2000-3000) or perhaps simply a duration increase (~6 minutes)

6- Debuffs, Cast Slow needs a larger Resist check (4 out of 5 anguish trash mobs say: "sorry beastlord, your slow doesn't work on me") Steeltrap Jaws, while interesting, is not reliable enough for me to consider using. Incapacitate is simply out of date, and needs upgrading.

7- Cures: my Clicky from PoFire is still my best cure spell, that ain't right.

8- Haste: Convenience mostly here, either group it, extend its duration or decrease it's cast time or better yet, all three!

9- Buffs: Focus should end up somewhere above the previous tier's shaman buffs, but below the current tier's buffs, Stat upgrades would be nice to have, as we haven't gotten new stat buffs since Planes.

10- Rake is in need of a DPS upgrade, simply put.

Things already discussed.

Melee Proc spells - I don't want them personally, i feel this would turn us into 'mini-shaman' and not stack with their procs (SoE loves to put similar lines for us into stacking conflicts with other spell lines), dumping these spells into the 'well it's nice, but only when a shaman isn't around' category.

DoTs, if they worked (i.e. weren't resisted 9/10 casts) i would use one or two, i used to do that while raiding Vex Thal back in the day.  As they are now, they're near-useless and should be abandoned.

Frenzy of Spirit- i never really thought about the effect too much (tag FoS, hit BE, then tap BA when disc fades) but an upgrade to this with overcap haste% would be pretty nifty.

[Humlaine]

I would like to see a self rune, or self only ac buff that stacks with everything else in game. Do we even have a self only ac buff, other than the kunark tunic clicky? I'm still using that...so sad.

Upgrade to SE.

Definately a group haste a la talisman of celerity.

another pet/beast short-term damage modifying like the one I never got because of 69.4 :(

until brael and the dev's finish working on the change for AC that is duel out with SoF, a AC buff is likely not to happen, with our current soft cap, we get diminishing returns as it is past the 1900 ac mark

[Humlaine]

I am gonna start email dev's on this later today, a few things I am gonna hit on is pet survivabilty, pet dps, growl and rake upgrades, paragon scaling, haste, gonna try and push for  less cast time / longer duration, a new cripple, new slow with a higher resist check, I am gonna suggest mod 2's of the owner be added to pets, but I doubt it will be looked into really, also see if we cant get some resist checks added into our dots, making them more viable to use.

I've got alot of stuff and a short amount of time to get it ready for when SoF beta rolls around, lets see if we cant get some if not all of this pushed through there.

[Sikkem]

Attack debuff added to a new cripple spell that stacked with shaman and druid debuffs would be nice and give us a debuff roll on raids.

[Mewzee]

Sorry but just wanted to make a quick post....these are all ideas I had in the past and had posted in the old ideas thread...so here we go....hope you can make sense out of all this.

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Bite of the Empress - this is a new line for Beasts. We are getting a Poison Nuke. it is 2494 damage but at a 758 mana cost. It is a .5 sec cast with a 30 sec refresh.  I got crits of 4998 with a fellow Bst with DK Poison focus getting 7k crits. This is Nice IMO.

The above spell example and new line being introduced by TBS.. I had the same idea a few months ago but I forgot it and forgot to post it, also to tell the truth I wasn't too sure if the devs would be keen on us stealing SK poison nukes...but seems I was wrong.

Anyway the idea is simple, all of our current dots for poison and disease, should be poison and disease nukes, being .5 seconds to cast and 30 sec refresh. Damage probably needs to be modified and scaled in previous spells to be comparable to this spell in TBS. But that would definately be much nicer than having useless DOT spells.

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Quote from: Eflynn on December 09, 2006, 01:27:12 PM

- give beasties a spell (or spell line) so we can turn into our warders, more than just an illusion, like rangers, druids, and shammies .... give some atk or run speed maybe and double attack or damage mod

- never thought of the ability to send warders out like stalking probes ... but I like it!

- group haste and Sow are both long overdue (as well as IoS ... but at least we got a group Focus)

- warders NEED to have run speed factored into summon or just give then perma SoW

- new warder models are LONG overdue also, although they've been announced as coming down the line, they still aren't around.  1 thing changing the troll warder did was polarize those who liked the old model and those that didn't ..... maybe while putting new models in place they could give us a way off choosing between 2 or 3 different models - furthering the character customization, even if it's only different colors.
----end quote of Elfynn----

I agree with a majority of all the above suggestions...

I especially love the idea for illusions for beastlords, I had thought of that one myself a long time ago but never posted or talked about it, just wished it in my mind lol...

The idea of sending my pet to "search" for mobs and check out areas to pull and be like an eye of zomm type deal...damn ..never thought of it..and I like the idea very much that would be cool!

New pet models and being allowed to CHOOSE and even CHANGE your warder into IMHO ANY OF THE WARDERS that are available just like we can change our fur/face (vah shir along with all other races) would be super cool.

Another really cool idea would be if specific quests (that can be soloable for bsts only) could be to "collect" new warder graphics by "capturing" these new warders, that would be MAJOR COOL and something FUN for the class itself to do, and add the above customization of being able to pick your warder/change what your warder looks like, whenever the heck you want. That would definately make things DIFFERENT. A Vah Shir Beastlord with a wolf pet...or a Iksar Beastlord with a Bear pet ect...

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Aura of Spirit type of idea -

why don't we have a new AA ability line that is connected to our Paragon line. This brand new line called Wild Spirit of the Beast can give beastlords an innate ability to have our AoS/Purrfection give the raid the chance to be able to "critical heal" themselves with either mana or hp while they're in combat mode aka meleeing or casting spells on others/NPCs...make it be in three ranks, the first rank gives you a 5% chance of these crit heals for mana or hp being able to happen, the 2nd and 3rd ranks give an innate 1% gain, being a total of 7% chance for this to happen to the raid, ourselves when we solo, or groups. Of course this will only affect the Paragon line not other healing spells, and it will depend on beastlords using the paragon ability which will retain its 15min refresh timer, and MGB with its 1hour timer.

The way I'm thinking for it to work is like this, AEs are hitting the raid, MGB Heals are thrown, Beastlord throws MGB AOS with new innate ability Wild Spirit, group #1 is being healed normally by AoS with normal hp/mana return, all the sudden 1 person in group #1 crit heals themselves 2300 mana return with a nuke, once a person crit heals themselves for mana or hp perhaps have AoS stop healing that particular person(?) or let AoS continue to heal normally after the crit. Another example: person in group #5 crit heals themselves for 1000 hps. The minum and maximum mana/hp return can range from at least 100 mana/hp to 5k being the max amount of crit heal or mana(?). And of course this will happen rarely, but still theres a chance for it to occur.

Maybe this new type of line ability is the way to give us utility back to the raid without scaling Paragon line and by making this random to happen it wouldn't be considered overpowering. So what do you think? btw percentss, numbers ect can all be played around with - these are just made up examples i gave trying to explain my idea and to find the most decent way we can gain utility and have something that can be considered somewhat useful and interesting for the raid to use again.

Also new spell request -

Feral Cloak - Beastlord self only TIMED Invis - 3 second casting time, 30 second refresh - 200 mana (?) OR Make it an AA ability to buy for 9 AAs, and make it instant cast like Druid Camo invis.

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More ideas for beastlords....

Doesn't it seem weird that Shaman can turn into a Werewolf via AA and have it as a permanet illusion and beastlords cannot do that?

Well I think we should have an AA that turns us into a Werewolf like shammys, called Pact of the Wurine or Beast or Feral Pact(?), this AA will turn us into Light Grey Werewolves (light grey would be a different shade than the BE pet color, would be shades lighter, or maybe brown or reddish brown?) and have it improve our run speed, increase accuracy with hits, increase hps and mana slightly (as in like a self buff of additional 500hps/mana?) and increase our dps.

That would be cool and fun I think...and would look bad ass. Numbers for the increase in hp/mana, dps, accuracy ect. all can be played with, I was just coming up with this on the spot so gimme a break =p.

Also something I think we need as spell utility are the following:

Talisman of the Tribunal - it sucks that Shammys are only ones who can cast this and that it takes one spell slot, while beastlords are left behind casting two spells for diease and poison. Give it to us already geez it can't hurt to have it.

Group Haste - again beastlords are half shammys, you didn't give us any spells in the past to have us follow shammys when you should have, so now your gonna have to give us all previous old group haste spells, plus a brand new one that is current and decent to the shaman line for bsts please.

Old Haste called Celerity - for the love of all that is nature, PLEASE FIX THE SPELL to last longer duration according to level like it should be, we've been asking this forever.

Minohten Mending (all ranks) - needs an upgrade, this spell should be like rangers current spell Potamid Salve it should be a single target heal, and it should cure its target of all Poison/disease/curses.

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Those are all my old ideas and some ideas that others posted that I agreed with or would like to perhaps see for the fun factor ect.

Also I have a BRAND NEW IDEA for Beastlords and our aggro issues...I am not sure if it will work and it will require more testing..also I am not sure exactly if theres a program I could use to test this or if others would be willing to test this idea along with me...but I am in the high end raiding game (AG/FC, and soon Solteris) and I have been getting alot of aggro issues, mostly because of nuking, procs and my weapons...I'm not really sure what the problem is...none of my weapons have CS procs, and I have even reduced my nuking and I'm still high on aggro list, I'm so high on aggro list I beat our zerkers on raids (lol).  I also assist quickly but not quicker than a tank/MT hehehe..I have to stop attacking sometimes because I have pulled off aggro for a second or two (as have others in my guild of other classes) during AG events, but the point is, Roar of Thunder isn't much help and we lack a way to reduce our aggro issues.

We could request for an AA skill to be created like Roar of Thunder but with a lower refresh timer like Feral Swipe maybe, or a spell type like rangers have called Jolt and Jolt Kick....but the idea that I have been testing lately is....a spell..from rangers called Nature's Viel.

The spell costs around 250 mana, lasts around almost 24 minutes, and its an aggro reducer/proc. I still am not entirely sure how it works (lol), but I talked to some of the zerkers in my guild and they told me how they wear that buff very often, along with rogues. So I have started to request it, and I think I have seen my aggro go down some but I'm not really sure...but this spell gave me the inspiration that perhaps that is what beastlords need. We need a self only aggro reducing proc type spell like Nature's Viel. We can call it Spirit of Nature or something...=p still haven't come up with a good name...

Ok so tell me what you think...thanks for listening as always...

[thor]

Just a note but combat effects does not effect buff type proc rates just proc rates on weapons procs and aug procs

[Mewzee]

Also wanted to make a link to the previous discussion about the top ten that I had created a while ago.

Please just read it over again whenever you have time Humlaine for some reference and ideas.

Old (New) Top Ten List
http://forums.beastlords.org/index.php?topic=7401.0

[Krinsh]

I agree we really need a no drop invis. AA or what ever it is something.

[Shamno]

A no drop invis would be great, but I haven't had huge issues with the current one. It actually works pretty well for me lol.

I think IoS could now be merged into our focus line. The spell portion is useless now with stat caps but if they ever remove them it will return some use to it and safe us from casting 2 buffs. They probably can review back and merge IoS with a previous focus version and allow the upgrade to those to filter up depending on where they put it. I am not totally sure I want to start asking for the wunshi specific line really, but a moderate knock off wouldn't hurt. We really don't even need the stat overcap portion since they should be removing said caps this next beta.

Group haste of our current haste percentage is long over due. Not to worried about increasing its percentage unless shaman and chanters get a good solid upgrade in that area.

Beastlords should be staying with rangers on cures like we do heals. Tss probably needs revisted and add a copy of their cures for beasts. Then allow for the upgrade in this next expansion.

Prism skin recourse needs to be put back on par with mages, by allowing 2 hits for us if it hasn't already.

Typical DPS upgrades.. Growl, rake, SF, FS, Ice nuke, Poison nuke.

Protective upgrade will be shiny, but to me not a pressing issue.

Beastial Alignment..I think scales so I don't see a huge reason to upgrade that yet....but might need revisited just in case.

I have no desire to see mammoth, panther, or any other mod type abilities stem from the shaman lines. We should have more unique things added in place.

[Camikazi]

Melee Proc spells - I don't want them personally, i feel this would turn us into 'mini-shaman' and not stack with their procs (SoE loves to put similar lines for us into stacking conflicts with other spell lines), dumping these spells into the 'well it's nice, but only when a shaman isn't around' category.

I think the proc most are talking about is the same kind that other hybrids have, and those do stack with panther. I have a feeling they never gave us a self proc like other hybrids since they gave us procs for pet, but I would still like to have one =)

Bite of the Empress - this is a new line for Beasts. We are getting a Poison Nuke. it is 2494 damage but at a 758 mana cost. It is a .5 sec cast with a 30 sec refresh.  I got crits of 4998 with a fellow Bst with DK Poison focus getting 7k crits. This is Nice IMO.

The above spell example and new line being introduced by TBS.. I had the same idea a few months ago but I forgot it and forgot to post it, also to tell the truth I wasn't too sure if the devs would be keen on us stealing SK poison nukes...but seems I was wrong.

Bite is not us taking the SK nukes, our nuke is basically a smaller version of Sting of the Queen, except Sting is 12 sec refresh ours is 30 sec.

[Humlaine]

the spell set up for SoF is already picked by SoE, that being sad, its not unlikely that we can get somethings changed or even removed from the said spell list.  We need as many people do be in beta as possible to give feedback to the devs.  Without good feedback its gonna be hard for them to fix and adjust our spell list from what it normally is