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Top 10 Fanfaire concerns

Started by Quinnotetiquan, July 28, 2008, 08:16:05 PM

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Karilis

As far as a deaggro ability, I think a swarm aa like Mages Companion of Necessity is the best idea, that instead spawns 1, 2, 3, 4, (Or AoE based on mobs in a 20, or 50 foot radius) medium hitpoint (half of the rampaging servant/companion of necessity hps) very very low damage, talking 1-30 damage swings, flock of wolves, werewolves, warders, something like that, that "explode" a huge deaggro component, or even a fade(I almost said a memory whipe, but that is -NOT- what I meant).  And none of that 1 damage to break mez crap, just make it a hatelist based swarmpet, if the pet gets one that is on hatelist that is mezzed, it spawns but gives you the "I cannot attack that target master" message.

I think it's what Roar of Thunder should have been, Roars sound like area of effect abilities to me, and it should probably have paralyzed them in fear/"blinked" them leaving them 1 second mezzed with fade component.  If they want to give us a reliable source of a nice chunk of Debuff, that's fine, but Roar of Thunders Deaggro component seems to add up to just barely more than, or just barely, the total of its DD + Debuff hatred.

I imagine an aa like "Pack necessity" whether it be the 1 or more swarmpets, or more per level of the aa, would be a pretty amazing utility, but if designed properly, it wouldn't give us the ability to replace/become a secondary puller, because it should make all of the creatures in a pull forget about us, but on raids, Though eventually people may find a way to abuse it.  Maybe if we're really adamant about it, they'ld give it to us, but it would do something like "split" our warder into "companions of necessity" thereby killing it, and rendering it a much less desirable ability, and more of an escape card.

Maylian

Quote from: Jazzera on August 14, 2008, 12:52:54 PM
Wru Maylian ! Garot said me he is missing u  :cry:

Garot only misses me since the other bsts slack. I haven't played EQ1 since April, played EQ2 for a bit and had fun but moved house recently and didn't take my PC with me so have no way of playing now. Actually have got back to RL since going to the gym, starting Muay Tuay and basketball again, if there are some good changes I may come back though.

Damim

As far as de-aggro goes, we should get an ability that one of our parent classes gets, but a low skill in it:  Feign Death!  :evil:

Quinnotetiquan

#33
Quote from: Karilis on August 14, 2008, 01:57:14 PM
As far as a deaggro ability, I think a swarm aa like Mages Companion of Necessity is the best idea, that instead spawns 1, 2, 3, 4, (Or AoE based on mobs in a 20, or 50 foot radius) medium hitpoint (half of the rampaging servant/companion of necessity hps) very very low damage, talking 1-30 damage swings, flock of wolves, werewolves, warders, something like that, that "explode" a huge deaggro component, or even a fade(I almost said a memory whipe, but that is -NOT- what I meant).  And none of that 1 damage to break mez crap, just make it a hatelist based swarmpet, if the pet gets one that is on hatelist that is mezzed, it spawns but gives you the "I cannot attack that target master" message.

I think it's what Roar of Thunder should have been, Roars sound like area of effect abilities to me, and it should probably have paralyzed them in fear/"blinked" them leaving them 1 second mezzed with fade component.  If they want to give us a reliable source of a nice chunk of Debuff, that's fine, but Roar of Thunders Deaggro component seems to add up to just barely more than, or just barely, the total of its DD + Debuff hatred.

I imagine an aa like "Pack necessity" whether it be the 1 or more swarmpets, or more per level of the aa, would be a pretty amazing utility, but if designed properly, it wouldn't give us the ability to replace/become a secondary puller, because it should make all of the creatures in a pull forget about us, but on raids, Though eventually people may find a way to abuse it.  Maybe if we're really adamant about it, they'ld give it to us, but it would do something like "split" our warder into "companions of necessity" thereby killing it, and rendering it a much less desirable ability, and more of an escape card.

That could easily be incorporated into our Howl spell. Right before it dies it could do about a howling 2k hate debuff. Or the spell itself could autocast a hate debuff that hits within 18 seconds

Denti

I have to agree with Damim, one of our parent classes allready has a nice deaggro ability and there is no real reason why we shouldn't get a lower skill form of FD. As it is Monks have FD with a max skill of 200, giving beastlords a version which maxes around 125 to 150 would be reasonable and in line what SKs get from Necros.

Maylian

Try arguing that case with SoE...I made the same argument back in SoF beta and before and got shot down for it.

Grbage

Quote from: Denti on August 16, 2008, 09:05:56 AM
I have to agree with Damim, one of our parent classes allready has a nice deaggro ability and there is no real reason why we shouldn't get a lower skill form of FD. As it is Monks have FD with a max skill of 200, giving beastlords a version which maxes around 125 to 150 would be reasonable and in line what SKs get from Necros.

While I wouldn't mind FD it would make us a bit overpowered. You have to remember it is skill+lvl which would make us a FD puller+buffer+slower+dps class. I believe other classes would rightfully complain.

How about just unlikning the deagro part of roar from the damage/debuff portion of the aa. Then put it on the same timer as jolting kick and call it good.
Grbage Heep
85 Beast of Torv

Denti

I know its a nearly impossible case to argue but in the days where a tank puller (yup, SKs) class can easily do 4k dps and very easy over 2k sustained lets me wonder where a not so good dps class with some group utility but no raid utility stands.

Lets face it, in todays game a druid debuffing atk does more for the tanks survival than a beastlord casting slow, our dps while good was seriously nerfed not so long ago and becomes comparable to good dps SKs and our buffs are lackluster or just plain not working anymore, those still working get handed out to shamans in the form of potions.

So we do need a certain fix, be it very much improved dps (which will step on pure melee toes) or increased survivability and utility (via improved buffs/debuffs and FD).

Karilis

I wonder if asking for our next "slow upgrade" to be the same as sha's revenge,  same mana cost, same duration, same percent slow, a -30 resist check like legacy (without the stupid halved duration, or even better, a -50 or -60 resist check) would be out of line?

Then maybe they would give us at least half of what we asked for, either a better resist check for the same mana, or re-up the duration for less mana, or something.  Not that I really desire these things, I just stick with Sha's Revenge, I haven't even bothered getting Sha's legacy, I'm often slowing 3-9 mobs at a time, and then tearing through them one by one... doubling my mana cost, AND halving the duration so I have to recast on them all again a few seconds later?  I couldn't deal with that.  Doesn't matter though, what I think would knock out two birds with one stone is:

Sony wants to give us a "slow upgrade" the next expansion, we know they do, they probably want it to be another one of those stupid pet proc slows, which I also will not purchase.  Instead, to give us something we want:

Have our slow, be sha's revenge, + recourse: 3, 5, 10 minute talisman of celerity. I know they don't want to give us a decent duration haste buff, ever.   So, for cheap mana, how about putting haste on something we cast every fight, rather than something we shouldn't have to cast more than once an hour?  I'm in no way, ever, going to use peerless penchant for the recourse(I think I'll block the buff just in case it overwrites actual celerity), that mana hog that it is.

Same idea with incapacitate, either give us cripple, or incap with a recourse?  It doesn't need to cost more mana, as it's supposed to be an 'upgraded spell' and honestly, recourses of spells we already have, aren't upgrades, they're just a way of shortening the work for everyone involved. 

If you're going to give us something we can do anyway, almost for free (ornate leather tunic pattern anyone? potions?) slap it on something useful, without ramping up the mana cost on it, or even slap it on something useless, say a level 81 upgrade to flash of light for example, hah, a 30 second 50% haste recourse(Single? group?) in the short duration window, would that make any of you use a spell slot on flash of light rather than hasting yourself? 

If they left the mana cost on it cheap as hell, I'ld do it, or if it were 100-300 mana, but lasted a decent amount of time, or was a group recourse, or both, I'ld use it, depending on if it was efficient enough, if it just proved to be a mana soak, it's back to 1 minute hasting the entire group for 27 minutes bp clicking.

Honestly the beastlord class is great, it's pretty fine, it's got really good sustainability, better than most if we're capable of getting outside buffs (clarity potions or clarity line, a better lasting haste from an enchanter, stat buffs from a shaman) but frankly, I hope they continue the trend of moving away from the mindset that the group content should be geared towards people who are previous expansion raid geared, and raid buffed.

I'm on the bandwagon with everyone else that in -capped size high tier raid guilds- we serve little purpose until we start getting into endurance fights.  (Could you imagine a boss mob with between 6 and 56 million hp, 90% melee, 90% spell mitigation?)  I'm not sure, maybe if they did that, they would leave DoT mitigation at 0% and give it low resists... or maybe they'ld make it uber resistant and leave the mitigation at 90% on DoTs too...  What classes would you bring to a raid to take down said critter?  Would knowing its DPS change your minds?  Would it having adds change your mind?  If you're limited to 42, 52, 54'ish people, and the script requires certain classes to be present, or certain abilities to be used, do you pick one raid force, and even if you have 72 guild members, since you -need- that force to complete it, do the other 20-30 guild members never get a chance at the loot on that one?

Basically what I'm asking is, if you were a guild leader of a raid guild, taking on Prophecy of Ro, TSS, TBS, or even SoF right now, what does it currently take for you to want a specific class in your ranks?  -Especially- what does, or what would it take for you to want a Beastlord in your ranks, if you weren't one yourself, two, three, four beastlords?  What if mob difficulty/script dictated that you needed at least/exactly 7 knights, 15 pure intel casters, 4 rangers, 3 monks, 3 rogues, 3 berserkers, -10- warriors, and 8 pure wisdom casters, what would your final slot be on a 54 person raid?  Another intel caster? another rogue? another berserker? A beastlord?

nedoirah

I have a small idea for our deagro ability. Give roar of thunder a chance to completely wipe agro almost like a memblur instead of giving us something like FD (monks will throw a royal fit). Make it work on the principle of the roar is so powerful that it leaves the target not only shaken and less willing to attack the bst but the ringing in the ears is so disorienting that they forget about the bst entirely.

Panthur

And what happens if your agro on 5000 mobs from someone's uber train? Ug. That you can't even target? Cus they are out of range, below the world whatever. Stil screwed :P